Audeze LCD-2

[kevin gilmore]

Birgirs were definitely rev1 or earlier, original cable and box, otherwise hard to tell.

The originally supplied cable is mechanically horrible.

Mine are rev2's and they certainly don't have a soundstage problem with the right amplifier.

SR-009 still better at just about everything except low thunderous bass.

I'll be making up some balanced cables soon from a roll of pure silver teflon from 1957.

Practicing my weaving on cheap teflon first.

[complin]

Birgirs were definitely rev1 or earlier, original cable and box, otherwise hard to tell.

The originally supplied cable is mechanically horrible.

Mine are rev2's and they certainly don't have a soundstage problem with the right amplifier.

SR-009 still better at just about everything except low thunderous bass.

I'll be making up some balanced cables soon from a roll of pure silver teflon from 1957.

Practicing my weaving on cheap teflon first.

Don't get me wrong i'm not saying they don't soundstage its just not that big as most other high end phones.

Mine are Rev 1's with ALO copper and silver chain cable. Apparently according to Audeze there is no easy way to determine which version they are as the serial numbers are not contiguous. They told me you have to contact them direct with the serial to determine which version of drivers are installed. I also use silver interconnects between DAC and amplifier which seems to give them an extra lift at the top end, but might push Rev2's to being over bright.

Your suggestion regarding using these direct out of a transformer coupled amp i'll try, but do you suggest connecting them direct without any protection or via one of those headphone socket/amp switch boxes?

http://www.amazon.co.uk/B-TECH-Speaker-Switch-Headphone-Socket/dp/9792400966/ref=sr_1_2?s=diy&ie=UTF8&qid=1323690195&sr=1-2

I've also have one of those Antique Sound Labs UHC Signature Headphone Listening Devices

http://www.divertech...csignature.html you connect to the terminals of a power amp. I believe they have small impedance matching transformers inside. Do you think something like this might work well or could be as an alternative with an OTL amp?

Edited December 12, 2011 by complin

[spritzer]

Mine are early rev.1 and more importantly, should be here tonight.

Kevin tried them on a lot of amps and it is quite clear what these headphones require, current, more current and then some even more current.

[complin]

Mine are early rev.1 and more importantly, should be here tonight.

Kevin tried them on a lot of amps and it is quite clear what these headphones require, current, more current and then some even more current.

So would these be a good candidate for one of the Nelson Pass's Current Source Designs aka FirstWatt F1?

(I'm told the F1 is great with the AKG K1000 too, but never heard one)

Edited December 12, 2011 by complin

[recstar24]

Obviously I don't have the measurement gear like Kevin but I think it's a bit silly to start thinking FW to drive these things. No reason to start overhyping the power demands of these cans, they don't need that much to my ears to sound decent. Last thing we need are amp makers creating 50 w headphone amps.

[kevin gilmore]

There is a big difference between decent and stellar.

I think one of the smaller and older firstwatt things would

probably sound fantastic. 4 wire ONLY. One of these

days, i may try it.

50 watt amplifier into 8 ohms is about 7 watts into 60 ohms

which is still WAY too much for lcd2's. However it actually

is about right for he6's

Edited December 12, 2011 by kevin gilmore

[complin]

Obviously I don't have the measurement gear like Kevin but I think it's a bit silly to start thinking FW to drive these things. No reason to start overhyping the power demands of these cans, they don't need that much to my ears to sound decent. Last thing we need are amp makers creating 50 w headphone amps.

The F1 is about 10 watts which should be just about right for job

I use my Audeze with an NVA AP10H which is 15 watts, but its transistor not valve so no transformer coupling (NVA are small UK boutique manufacturer)

[spritzer]

I wasn't really referring to 50W/8ohm amps but rather high current capable amps. This does rule out most of the amps out there though, OTL, chipamps, amps claiming to be high current but aren't etc. It's a similar situation to the electrostatics, you can drive them with very low current since in theory they don't need any power but the benefits of ample current supply are clear.

[recstar24]

There is a big difference between decent and stellar.

I think one of the smaller and older firstwatt things would

probably sound fantastic. 4 wire ONLY. One of these

days, i may try it.

50 watt amplifier into 8 ohms is about 7 watts into 60 ohms

which is still WAY too much for lcd2's. However it actually

is about right for he6's

Being an F1 owner myself (with the new output jfets mind you), I'm not complaining - I would simply say most users that are using the lcd2 are using something that is giving them the general idea of what they sound like.

[spritzer]

Just got mine and I dare say I like them a whole lot more than the early units at CJ'10. They aren't Stax but at the used price they give the Lambdas and ESP950 a proper run for their money. Bloody heavy though so Audeze really should look into suspended arc setups.

Now the M3 will never be considered the best amp there is so they might get a bit better once I finish the Super-symmetry Dynahi and Dynafet. Time to increase the standing current on the M3 though...

Btw. What were Audeze smoking when they came up with this cable? No glue used to secure either the heatshrink or the techflex so it just slides all over the place. Just makes it easier to tear it down and do it properly but still..

[complin]

Being an F1 owner myself (with the new output jfets mind you), I'm not complaining - I would simply say most users that are using the lcd2 are using something that is giving them the general idea of what they sound like.

Yes whilst that's true I think we are trying to determine what might be an ideal type of amplifier for the LCD2's. I've tried them on several and as Kevin says the results can be variable, particularly as most of them put out 1 watt or less. So can you share your experience with the F1 and other amplifiers you have tried?

[deepak]

Just got mine and I dare say I like them a whole lot more than the early units at CJ'10. They aren't Stax but at the used price they give the Lambdas and ESP950 a proper run for their money. Bloody heavy though so Audeze really should look into suspended arc setups.

Now the M3 will never be considered the best amp there is so they might get a bit better once I finish the Super-symmetry Dynahi and Dynafet. Time to increase the standing current on the M3 though...

Btw. What were Audeze smoking when they came up with this cable? No glue used to secure either the heatshrink or the techflex so it just slides all over the place. Just makes it easier to tear it down and do it properly but still..

I liked them on the Dynamite. Of course that amp also elevated the HD600 to sound better than the LCD-2

[luvdunhill]

What about a 400W class A buffer, 4-wire of course?

Edited December 12, 2011 by luvdunhill

[cobra_kai]

Mine sound pretty damn good out of my single ended beta 22. Which is something like 3.5 watts into 50 ohms

[recstar24]

Yes whilst that's true I think we are trying to determine what might be an ideal type of amplifier for the LCD2's. I've tried them on several and as Kevin says the results can be variable, particularly as most of them put out 1 watt or less. So can you share your experience with the F1 and other amplifiers you have tried?

I have only used the f1 for what it was designed for, you know, single driver speakers, so I can't attest to its headphone or lcd2 driving capabilities. I like the lcd2 and one of its strengths is that it doesn't require heroic amplification to sound good IMO, compared to some of the other orthos in the market.

[kevin gilmore]

What about a 400W class A buffer, 4-wire of course?

Works for me in the winter. In the summer, not so much.

[spritzer]

After a couple of days with the LCD-2's I dare say I like them a lot. The sound reminds me of the SR-007Mk1 and their faults are few and far between. The bass is just a tad bit loose (probably the M3 at fault) and the top end is even darker than on the 007 but other than that these are very, very good.

Now the build quality is atrocious though. I was never a fan of the headband but it's just falling apart and I need to have the headphone hangers powder coated since the paint is flaking off. The old Stax units used a very similar system but they have held up for 40+ years with no issues.

I just got some Rean connectors so the horrid stock cable is gone and in its place a Sennheiser HD650 cable. It's much thinner than the stock unit but it seems to be letting the basses through ok...

[seacard]

The sound reminds me of the SR-007Mk1

That's some high praise. I might have to give them another shot if you think they are in the Stax league.

[blessingx]

I've since moved back to HD800s, but the LCD2s were strong enough to shift me away from the 4070s.

[guzziguy]

It's much thinner than the stock unit but it seems to be letting the basses through ok...

That's not possible. Everybody knows that bass molecules are too large to fit through a Sennheiser HD650 cable. That's why their sound is veiled.

[seacard]

I've since moved back to HD800s, but the LCD2s were strong enough to shift me away from the 4070s.

I, too, liked the HD800s better than the LCD2s. However, I didn't think either sounded as good as the 007, or the HE60. I haven't yet tried the 4070s, although I think there may be a pair sitting on my doorstep right now.

[complin]

That's not possible. Everybody knows that bass molecules are too large to fit through a Sennheiser HD650 cable. That's why their sound is veiled.

No no you are wrong.

Its a closely guarded secret that Sennheiser specially treat their cables in Switzerland @ the Hedron Collider, they are all bombarded with atomic particles including the Higgs Boson (God Particle) so your headphones sound heavenly .

[Torpedo]

x3 I like better the HD800 + P-1 than the LCD-2 (Rev2) + Beta-22. However I see them as different tools for different uses. Kind of the difference between the 007 and 009.

[spritzer]

The LCD-2 sure isn't perfect but I like it for the same reason I like the oldest Stax headphones, the flaws don't detract from the enjoyment of the beautiful, beautiful music.

That's not possible. Everybody knows that bass molecules are too large to fit through a Sennheiser HD650 cable. That's why their sound is veiled.

It's quite sad that a majority of people buying these headphones would believe it... Regardless I'm hearing that Kevin will be making a special limited edition vintage silver cable for these phones and I'm sure I will be sent a free sample in exchange for some shilling. This seems to be the normal arrangement on HF these days...

x3 I like better the HD800 + P-1 than the LCD-2 (Rev2) + Beta-22. However I see them as different tools for different uses. Kind of the difference between the 007 and 009.

I for one have never been able to like the HD800. It does some things ok but for that type of sound the HE60 is simply better in every way.

[dsavitsk]

I for one have never been able to like the HD800.

First time I heard them, I agreed. After playing with them a little last weekend, my sense is that to my ears they, like Grados, do much better with an amp that has a non-zero Zout. High feedback just seems to lead to over damping, but run them with something that has a Zout around 10 Ohms and they warm up nicely and gain a little punch.

The LCD's sound pretty nice, but I can't get past how heavy they are.

Edited December 14, 2011 by dsavitsk