Best Sennheiser?

[Wmcmanus]

Yes I think theyre leagues (technically) better too, but not more engaging. Theres a reason why, overall, I prefer grados over Senns.

Well put.

[jp11801]

not so shocking that I am the only one that prefers the HD800 to the HE90 (ducks, but thinks it is too soft in presentation)

[guzziguy]

I don't have enough experience with other Senns so I can't compare the HD800 to them. I prefer the HD800 over all my other headphones (K340, HP2, HF2). I think that Tyll described them well. They get out of the way of the music. They don't have wow factor, they just deliver the music as delivered from the source and amp. I can listen to it for hours with no fatigue and no discomfort.

To me it's what everybody says they want in music reproduction. I guess a lot don't really want it.

[mypasswordis]

A bit scathing, but not entirely uncalled for. Especially since I'm in the same camp. Anything outside of neutrality bugs the shit outta me and I can't let go of the colorations if they exceed my admittedly small tolerance. It's why I dislike the O2 MkI so much (disclaimer: haven't heard it out of crazy $$$ amps like the BHSE) and prefer the HD600 to the 650. You guys are really making me want to hear the HD800.

[Deadneddz]

The HD800 is a headphone that I have great interest in auditioning in private. From my experiences with various auditions I found them to have precise imaging and able to layer different sounds similar to the O2s. The one thing that seemed to be off from my listens was the soundstage not being unique to the recording like on the O2s. But hence my longing to really audition these in private to find out for myself. I'm really curious to those who found them technically marvelous but not musically pleasing as part of my joy in the O2s is in their technical merit. I just have this feeling that if I owned a pair i'd love them.

I have received my HE60s from Senneheiser recently along with Jim's HEV70.(Jim if you're reading this, its ready to go back to you.) I've been listening to the HE60 and its a completely different sound than the O2s. For some reason the HE60 pleases me even though it is technically not a very great headphone.(at least from my experience with the HEV70) Slightly harsh upper midrange, deepest bass is missing to me, lacks the weighty foundation/authority the O2s give music, not really detailed and diffused images, not much layering. But what bass is there is very tight and has little bloom and the increased treble can give sonics more bite and preceived clarity. Its a very fun headphone that sounds supremely fast, tight and clean. In fact, the fastest headphone i've ever heard(whether thats acutal or preceived). I like them enough to recable them and find out just how far the BH takes them. Since this poll is mainly between the Senn stats and the HD800/dynamics i'll refrain from voting until I further audition or own the HD800 for myself, but gosh I feel that the HEx0 series and the HD800 are just so different in presentation, in the end it would be impossible for me to choose one or the other. They both seem to excell at what they were engineered for.

[Wmcmanus]

not so shocking that I am the only one that prefers the HD800 to the HE90 (ducks, but thinks it is too soft in presentation)

At times like this, you've got to stand up as a man and defend your rights to freedom of speech, listening, and thought.

[Wmcmanus]

I don't have enough experience with other Senns so I can't compare the HD800 to them. I prefer the HD800 over all my other headphones (K340, HP2, HF2). I think that Tyll described them well. They get out of the way of the music. They don't have wow factor, they just deliver the music as delivered from the source and amp. I can listen to it for hours with no fatigue and no discomfort.

To me it's what everybody says they want in music reproduction. I guess a lot don't really want it.

Ken, have you listened to the HE90 or HE60 at any of the meets you've attended? If so, if only by vague memory, how did you think they did/would compare to the HD800?

[Wmcmanus]

*** snip ***

Since this poll is mainly between the Senn stats and the HD800/dynamics i'll refrain from voting until I further audition or own the HD800 for myself, but gosh I feel that the HEx0 series and the HD800 are just so different in presentation, in the end it would be impossible for me to choose one or the other. They both seem to excell at what they were engineered for.

Fair enough, if you don't feel you have an adequate basis to make a proper call on the HD800 vs HE90/HE60 issue, but it's never "impossible" to choose! Heck, I've even had to choose between shitting and grinning at times when listening to the HE90, and almost always keep grinning until I absolutely have to let loose.

Edit: Sorry, I keep posting as I read. Bad habit. Don't have the power to merge my own posts like I do at the other place.

[Dusty Chalk]

Lots of headphones become "meh" after you've put them through their paces. Most often, for me anyway, it's the ones that don't call undue attention to themselves in any way. The HP-2, for example. About as neutral and neutral can be and great for studio monitoring, but where is the spunk I'm looking for? Same with the K701. At first, I thought it had all sorts of promise but now it leaves me feeling bland. HD600 for that matter.

Maybe that's what is happening with the HD800. Too technical and not musical enough? Lacking in character, as in no coloration, nothing that grabs you on an emotional level and makes you want to listen for hours on end? The HE5's have this fail potential as well.

No, not at all, don't put meanings to my words. My attitude about this has always been the same: if your equipment is 'boring', listen to more interesting music.

No, my 'meh' reaction was not that they were neutral, but that they were too hard to drive well. We had several very good amps on hand, and it sounded best out of a preamp's headphone section. On all the tube amps, it sounded dark and undetailed.

I personally love neutral headphones, and some of my favorite combinations have been neutral headphones out of neutral amps. Because I do happen to listen to very interesting music. 'Meh' doesn't mean boring, but just that it did not rate as highly as its pricetag would imply that it should.

[Wmcmanus]

No, not at all, don't put meanings to my words. My attitude about this has always been the same: if your equipment is 'boring', listen to more interesting music.

No, my 'meh' reaction was not that they were neutral, but that they were too hard to drive well.

Fair enough. They do love power, that's for sure. Same with the HE-5, I'm learning of late.

I didn't mean to put meanings to your words. That's why I qualified it with "for me, anyway" and then later posed some questions at the end of my post. I was curious as to what your 'meh' meant in terms of what you did or didn't like about the HD800.

I'm interested in how people are reacting to the HD800's now that they've been in circulation for enough time for longer lasting impressions to be formed. They were the one pair of headphones released during this past decade that I thought might possibly survive the FOTM syndrome (or maybe FOTY in this case).

There's an expression in Cayman: "See me -- come live with me" that I've heard from time to time. It's usually spoken by mature, attractive women who know well what their limitations and weaknesses are, and don't want you to think they're as perfect as they may seem. Living with the HD800 might not be so easy either, but I'm a headphone polygamist so I probably don't notice its flaws as much as others may.

[tom_hankins]

HE90 > HD800 > either 650 or HE60 depending on amp > 600

[randerson3024]

I just got a new bad ass cable for my 800's, but I still think the 90's rank the best after all these years.

[Hopstretch]

Haven't had enough time with the 90s to rate them fairly. Of the others, I like the 800s over the 60s for comfort and soundstage and otherwise think they're in the same league. Wouldn't even consider the 6X0s again now for anything other than budgetary reasons.

As far as the 800's character -- one man's sterile is another man's incisive. Good Grados are more fun, but they don't match the out-of-head experience you can enjoy with the big Senns.

[agile_one]

I've owned them all, and for me the ranking is: HE90 > HD800 > HD650 > HD600 > HE60. Sometimes the 60 just shrieks with sibilance, so I could never relax when listening with it.

[spritzer]

HE60 > HD600 > HE90 > HD800.

The HE60 has to be properly refurbished and driven by a Blue Hawaii then it's easily the best model Senn has ever made. The HD600 may not be as refined as the He90 but they annoy me less and I could live with them day to day, something which can't be said about the He90. The HD800 is a fine headphone but nothing special. The HD650 I can't stand so it doesn't belong on the list.

[aerius]

The HD800 is a headphone that I have great interest in auditioning in private. From my experiences with various auditions I found them to have precise imaging and able to layer different sounds similar to the O2s. The one thing that seemed to be off from my listens was the soundstage not being unique to the recording like on the O2s.

That's one of the things I disliked about them when I had them on an extended loan. The soundstage is always big, if I go to a recording which was made in a small garage the soundfield should shrink down accordingly. It doesn't. Yeah the soundstage gets a bit smaller, but it doesn't go all the way down to room sized.

Get a copy of "Whites Off Earth Now!!" and "The Trinity Session" by the Cowboy Junkies. Same microphone, same recording engineer, same direct to DAT deck recording. But the first was in a garage while the latter was in a decent sized church, two very different acoustic environments and a heck of big difference in the size of the soundfield. On a good setup there's a big change in the soundstage size & characteristics between the two recordings, on the HD800, not so much. There's a change, but not as much as there should be.

"Whites" garage and Church of The Holy Trinity

[aardvark baguette]

I've only heard the HD650 and am going to kill you all.

[jinp6301]

BTW, I've heard a lot of variation between different HE-90s. Especially in soundstage and imaging.

[Dusty Chalk]

I was curious as to what your 'meh' meant in terms of what you did or didn't like about the HD800.

Well, then I'm glad I responded with more detail.

It's just that people who know me and know my tastes in gear know that I like neutrality (that is, if they take the time to remember, which I myself am not so good at always), so I was kind of taken off guard that you understood it pretty much exactly opposite.

[Wmcmanus]

Well, then I'm glad I responded with more detail.

It's just that people who know me and know my tastes in gear know that I like neutrality (that is, if they take the time to remember, which I myself am not so good at always), so I was kind of taken off guard that you understood it pretty much exactly opposite.

With the HD800, my experience so far has been akin to what it feels like to find that "perfect" girlfriend, at least initially. Yet, you instinctively know that she can't be that perfect, thus you're better off finding out what her hangups are sooner rather than later, which then softens the blow of the inevitable letdown. This is why I'm curious to learn more from those who aren't so taken by the HD800s in terms of what is missing and why. Sorry if in the midst of that I added my own interpretation to your post and got it all wrong.

Anyway, neutral headphones are good in my book as well. Much easier to live with in the long run because they're not as likely to become distracting and get in the way of the music. That's the way I'd go if I were trying to narrow down to just one or two pairs of headphones as keepers.

[Voltron]

HD800 > HE90 > HD650 > HD600 > HE60

Same as my boy toy, Gene, except he puts the softer more euphonious presentation of the HE90 over the more neutral HD800. On a great amp, the HD800 sounds as full of life and musicality as the recording it is presenting. Plenty of bass, plenty of presence, huge soundstage, etc. I still love the HD650 balanced, and always prefer them over the HD600 even though I think that is a fine can as well. I hate the HE60 and love the way the Stax mafia likes the HE60 but shits on the HE90. No accounting for taste.

[hirsch]

HE90 > HE60 > the rest of them

I listened to the HD800 on a bunch of amps, but for some reason it kept sounding like an HD800 which wasn't a sound I particularly liked. There may be a magical amp out there that transforms it (a friend on mine likes it with the Luxman P-1, although I didn't think it was that great a combo). I just never really enjoyed listening to the headphone.

[spritzer]

I hate the HE60 and love the way the Stax mafia likes the HE60 but shits on the HE90. No accounting for taste.

Pffft... I do think that a large potion of the HE60's out there aren't running at 100%, at least that has been my experience with the sets that have come through here. That includes the two "recently serviced" units which were clearly not done right by Sennheiser. Damn I want to buy a HE60 now...

[aerius]

It's just that people who know me and know my tastes in gear know that I like neutrality (that is, if they take the time to remember, which I myself am not so good at always), so I was kind of taken off guard that you understood it pretty much exactly opposite.

There is to me two kinds of neutral; true good neutral which is more or less a straight pass-through, which to me is exemplified by the Grado HP-2 in the headphone world and the Living Voice OBX-R in speakers. Then there's the kind of "neutral" which flattens and sucks the life out of all music and gives it all the same bland boring character, the K701 is a big offender here. Unfortunately I'm hearing way too much of the latter and not much of the former in the audio world.

Making everything sound flat and same-ish is not neutral, in fact I'd argue it's just as big of a colouration as say, the RS-1 which puts its own character on everything. I'd actually say that the HD800 isn't any more neutral than the HD650 or 600, all of them will put a distinct sound signature on the music.

[morphsci]

.... I hate the HE60 and love the way the Stax mafia likes the HE60 but shits on the HE90. No accounting for taste.

Well I do not really consider myself part of the Stax mafia but the HE-90 is simply colored the wrong way for my tastes and the HE-60 is simply colored less. Both are clearly inferior to the Omega.

Pffft... I do think that a large potion of the HE60's out there aren't running at 100%, at least that has been my experience with the sets that have come through here. That includes the two "recently serviced" units which were clearly not done right by Sennheiser. Damn I want to buy a HE60 now...

Hmmm, that is interesting. I was going to send my pair in to Sennheiser when I get my HEV-70 back. I may have to come up with a plan B now.