An oldie: HP1 vs. HP2

[morphsci]

Of course he does, he's listening to HP-1s.

[robm321]

hey man, you really can't listen to the HP-1/2 with bowls. you really cannot. flats only sir.

^ This is fact. Preference should be ignored in this case.

There's a very noticeable different from the UW bandwith cable vs the standard to my ears.

[Hopstretch]

There's a very noticeable different from the UW bandwith cable vs the standard to my ears.

Did anyone ever dissect the two cables (say in the process of reterminating to balanced) and note the physical differences? Maybe Alex at APS?

Also, oh all right I'll put the flats back on. Stop sending me hate mail, Gradouches.

Edited December 21, 2009 by Hopstretch

[morphsci]

I believe there are actually three Joe Grado cable types used on HP-1000s and the Laboratory Standard is the most recent as said HERE.

[Hopstretch]

I believe there are actually three Joe Grado cable types used on HP-1000s and the Laboratory Standard is the most recent as said HERE.

If you go downthread a dozen posts or so, we have JG telling someone else the exact opposite.

Part of the mystique I guess...

[recstar24]

Did anyone ever dissect the two cables (say in the process of reterminating to balanced) and note the physical differences? Maybe Alex at APS?

Also, oh all right I'll put the flats back on. Stop sending me hate mail, Gradouches.

I believe nikongod is the only one to actually post publicly what it looked like inside. I remember him posting that the UW was actually built pretty substantially, with some kind of cotton dialectric and whatnot.

[padam]

I believe there are actually three Joe Grado cable types used on HP-1000s and the Laboratory Standard is the most recent as said HERE.

That is correct, more precisely:

1st generation: Unsigned

reviewed as: dark, bass firm, treble roll-off (reviewed in The Absolute Sound)

2nd generation: Joseph Grado Signature Ultra-Wide Bandwidth Reference Cable

reviewed as: light, bass subdued, treble extended (reviewed in comparison with the "unsigned" cable, The Absolute Sound)

notes: developed by Joe Grado as a response to the alleged treble roll-off of the unsigned cable and offered as an upgrade.

3rd generation: Grado Signature Laboratory Standard Audio Cable

reviewed as: Sufficient bass and extended highs in comparison with the earlier cables

notes: developed by Joe Grado through the accumulated experiences/responses of the two earlier cables to perform as neutral as possible.

[Hopstretch]

Interesting. Thank you!

[Torpedo]

Interesting, I got it wrong then. I had the idea the Signature Ultra Band Width was the 3rd generation cable offering better sound than the Signature laboratory Standard, which was the 2nd after the no signed wire.

[nikongod]

I have read in several places that the "unsigned" cable was the RS-1 cable. Perhaps there are 2 unsigned cables.

Anyways, the ultrawide bandwidth cable is a piece of work. the individual wires are not bundles of strands as is common, rather there is a solid core of plastic (about 0.5mm) around which the strands are wound. then of course there is an insulating jacket. The 4 wires are all in the main jacket with a few strands of cotton thread between each, and another strand of similar plastic down the center. The overal construction is similar to cardas "clear tubular litz" except there is only a sinlge layer of strands over the core, and the core is solid. Anyone who replaces this cable for any reason other than it being broken is an idiot. ANYONE! Whoever designed this cable spent a ton of time thinking about how to put it together.

I have a standard bandwidth cable & RS-1 cable that I got from a well known headphone cable salesman. The standard bandwidth cable has slightly thicker insulation than the RS-1 cable, and the colors are different between the 2 (the insulation colors that is) but the overall construction of the actual wire is pretty plain bundles of copper.

I have also dissected the newest 8-strand cable. Im not a fan of how the individual strands are layed out IN the cable with all the "grounds" on one side, and all the "signals" on the other (I know, its a speaker, it dosnt have an inherent ground, I dont care either) I think it would be MUCH better to bundle them in individual mini-quad configurations. OTOH, the 8-conductor design is a nice step forwards as far as cable designs go.

On the tangent of OEM's building nice cables:

The HD-800 and D5000 cables are both exceptionally well built. ultrasone used ohlibach cable (it was considered a nice cable until meier had that falling out with them, now it may as well be lamp cord to the cable guys) for the ED-9 for sure.

[padam]

I guess that is because the meaning of the word 'Standard' can be misinterpreted.

Gathered a few more interesting info:

Grado HP-1000 Signature Series Drivers

--------------------------------------

Trasducer type: dynamic

Operating Principle: Open Air

Frequency Response: 18-24 kHz

Nominal impedance: 40 ohms

Drivers matched: 0.05 dB (HP-3 drivers are described as "not matched as closely")

Notes: The UHPLC used in the voice-coils of the HP-1000 drivers was also used in the connecting cables. I've read that the factory-equipped Ultra-Wide Bandwidth Grados also used this cord in the voice-coils. This seem to indicate that there may have been as much as three types of drivers (one for every type of signal cord). Some people have stated that there are drivers with inscriptions on the back (i.e. "Joseph Grado Signature Products") and some without any inscriptions. Some Grado SR-200 and SR-100 headphones use the same drivers as the HP-1000 Signature Series.

Grado HP-1000 Signature Series Aluminium Earcups

------------------------------------------------

1st Series: matte surface machined aluminium alloy, flat metal mesh

notes: The earcups don't appear as reflective as the later series

2nd Series: shiny surface machined aluminium alloy, flat metal mesh

notes: Lettering seems to shine a little bit brighter than the earlier series. The surface on which the lettering is placed seems a tiny bit more narrow than the previous matte series.

3rd Series: shiny surface machined aluminium alloy, domed metal mesh

notes: Domed metal mesh appears matte, otherwise similar to 2nd series.

HP-1 = Top Model, polarity Switches, verified specs and 0.05 db driver matching

HP-2 = verified specs and 0.05 db driver matching

HP-3 = verified specs and driver matching "not as well matched as hp-1 or hp-2"

To sum it up, there are probably quite a few HP-1000 variations there.

[some1x]

Don't forget the HP2i!!!

[recstar24]

Don't forget the HP2i!!!

Gotta love good ole' Joe...

Let me see, I sent my current HP's last May or so, and Joe charged me $300 for drivers and cabling and $50 for his "tune-up" process, which he mentioned was essentially his very thorough break in process, in which he hooks up the cans to the output of some oscilloscope and runs 20-20 frequencies at specific time intervals to completely break in and distress the driver. In addition he put some of his "magic" compound inside the outer rim of the enclosure. When I received the things well I swear it was the absolute best set of HP's I had ever heard, out of 6 total I have owned I think even two of them had received similar Joe treatment. When I called Joe he said he did every tweak/modification on mine that he had developed at that time, but when I pressed further he simply replied humorously that "he put a little spice here, a little paprika there, you know the usual".

Reading through the above thread, I think the stuff he is doing now is essentially the same as what he did for me but charging $1500 vs. the $350 which was his more normal rate.

[morphsci]

I'm pretty sure he switched from regular to mil-spec paprika recently. So the price increase is understandable.

[recstar24]

I'm pretty sure he switched from regular to mil-spec paprika recently. So the price increase is understandable.

[Hopstretch]

jimminy christmas.

Yeah. Drivers don't fail me now!

[Mr.Sneis]

Why the price difference in Hp-2 and Hp-1? I swear the Hp-1's are sold for more!

<- Hp-2 Owner

[recstar24]

Why the price difference in Hp-2 and Hp-1? I swear the Hp-1's are sold for more!

<- Hp-2 Owner

1) the switches look cool

2) People were able to hype up over the years that the HP1's were "superior" to the HP2's and HP3's. If anything, the HP1's offer one extra area where the headphones can go bad, and fixing the rat nest of wiring that is connected to the phase switch is a bitch and a half. John Grado will actually still offer to fix it for people as he was the one that originally built them but I believe he actually recommends leaving the switch disconnected.

[robm321]

Isn't it like $3K for new drivers, recable, tune up, etc. Basically, the works on top of the $1,500 or so for the HP-2s?

I think John's excessive mark up tactics are rubbing off on Joe - as much as I'd like the idea of an upgraded HP-2 with new drivers, it's a bit over the top in price.

[Hopstretch]

I acknowledge my prior error. Flats are correct on the HP1. I seek forgiveness.

Clarity flows from many, many re-listens to toe's "Our Next Movement" -- which just has an absolutely ridiculous amount of deep bass, fast bass and funky bass all going on at once. Switching back and forth with HD800s, there is no slack or flop or murk in the HP1-with-flats presentation. The experience is different -- with the Grados shaking your brain around inside your skull while the Senns flap your auricles from the outside -- but to me they are both absolutely "right".

Supplemental observation. Anyone who says HD800s are seriously bass-shy is a heartard.

[Voltron]

It's so nice when things work out peacefully and without the need for shovels.

[Salt Peanuts]

It's so nice when things work out peacefully and without the need for shovels.

or a dead horse.

[mypasswordis]

Or bow(e)ls?

[Hopstretch]

or a dead horse.

Whoops, Reks never got the memo. Um, that was the neighbor's son's car though, dude.