Room development. Advice from you fine chaps?

[TheSloth]

Another friend had the 988, not sure if they came from UK or China, but those sounded great and had no issues. The only "problem" with those is the frame not being stiff enough to keep the panel steady, so at high SPLs they tend to comb and make sound a bit undefined and diffuse. This is improved on the newer series using a more rigid frame

Absolutely, but it should be noted that the 63's are significantly worse than the 988's in respect to stiffness. I don't know if it's the case in America, but in the EU the 2905's come with a metal weight to attach to the underside of the frame, just to make it harder to topple over and comply with some ridiculous EU regulation. That bar itself, if you are really hard core and have the placement absolutely sorted, can be screwed into the floor directly. I suspect that combined with the tensions strut on the back pretty much solves the rigidity problems for good.

[Torpedo]

Yes indeed, the newer 2xxx series, building quality issues apart, are an improvement over the 9xx. However to my ears they are still handicapped dynamically. It's quite clear that they can't go any louder than 95-98 dB, so when listening classical music decently recorded/produced keeping dynamic swings of 50dB or more, by pumping up the volume you can hear soft sounds louder, but the loud ones can't go higher, which I find a personal deal breaker. That's not and issue with average recordings and pop, rock or jazz, which is compressed at mastering.

[swt61]

I know that but within that time window, clicking the edit button just gives me a spinning thing and nothing else happens.

I guess you'd better get it right the first time then.

[guzziguy]

I know that but within that time window, clicking the edit button just gives me a spinning thing and nothing else happens.

Maybe your browser thinks it's on another site?

[Duggeh]

Won't be able to audition for about a week. Speakers are still at the sellers house and he's not in atm. Much reading seems to point that the Quad 405, even pimped out, won't cut the mustard as far as power is concerned.

I wonder if Quad can turn a regular 909 into a 909 Mono if you send them back...

[spritzer]

If the 909 mono's are just bridged stereo amps then they should be able to do it.

[TheSloth]

Won't be able to audition for about a week. Speakers are still at the sellers house and he's not in atm. Much reading seems to point that the Quad 405, even pimped out, won't cut the mustard as far as power is concerned.

To drive what, 63's? I thought pimping out the 405 increased the max. current output, and there's certainly enough voltage to set of the protection circuit...

[Duggeh]

To drive the Soundlabs. For them 100watts is a recommended minimum, and from a 405, 115 is the best you can look to get. The 909 mono is 300watts (the 909 stereo is 140 per channel) and is unconditionally stable as Quad factor for their own electrostatics. It has the bonus of being quite reasonably priced and available used and catering to my dads decates long Quad bias.

[Duggeh]

If the 909 mono's are just bridged stereo amps then they should be able to do it.

That's my understanding from what I have read. It would be the expense of any replacement back panel, added onto the "minimum service charge" that would make things start to stack up.

[Torpedo]

Doug, first decide if the speakers are to your liking, then see how they fit your room. Just then, start hunting the power amp. Those speakers, as long as they sound like the Apogees and other planars, will reveal you too much of your upfront components. More than raw power, I'd be concerned about sound quality. Bridged to mono amps aren't exactly a candy in my experience.

[spritzer]

Yup, find the speaker you want and build from there.

[swt61]

Duggeh, you might also consider finding a used pair of NAD 2200 power amps. The 2200 in bridged mode is rated at 400 wpc.

I used a pair of them to drive my old ESS AMT 1D speakers. Those are the ones with the big ass Heil transformer on top, and the 2200's were stable as a rock, with a shitload of power. They can be had quite cheap now.

If an amp that old makes you nervous, there's the Emotiva route...

Emotiva Audio XPA-2 Two Channel Power Amplifier

[Duggeh]

Those Emotiva amps look serious business for the money.

Yeah speaker first, true that. I just like to sook up the gear pr0n.

[Duggeh]

Went along this afternoon for a listen. 2 MacIntosh 500 watt monoblocks (the power in a

[deepak]

Went along this afternoon for a listen. 2 MacIntosh 500 watt monoblocks (the power in a

[swt61]

Soundlab Millenium M3, I believe.

[Duggeh]

Indeed.

[spritzer]

Very power hungry to say the least since they are so... ehhh... small. A nice ESL63 would be a very nice option but do get them off the floor. Despite what Quad says, the new speakers are just redressed 63's with some extra panels on the 9 models. They must have asked Mikhail for help since MOAR!!! is always better...

[Duggeh]

Decided to give them a go anyway.

In place and Bryston photos not taken.

Sounded much nicer in the room once we had shuffled them around a bit than they did in the demo room at the shop. Bi-amped them with the NAD on the treble and the Quad on the bass. Sounded pretty nice until you turned the volume up into drive and then it went all bad. Additionally, the amps were running hot. The Quad would have certainly overheated and failed if we had kept it up.

The shop also loaned us a Bryston 300w/ch. Which did a considerably more admirable job.

However, the crux is that while they sound nicer than the Quad 21L. (They sound bloody lovely to my ears). It is very difficult to justify them sounding ten times better at ten times the cost, before amps are added in. I'll chat with dad about it tomo.

I think that dad had some secret dream that 'stats would offer him a presentation which was close to that of live music and finds himself dissapointed on that front.

And they do pull the hairs on your arms outward.

Edited July 31, 2009 by Duggeh

[deepak]

Were they still bass light with a tiny sweet spot in your own setup? The scale picture with your dad next to them is pretty cool.

[jinp6301]

The scale picture with the quads is pretty funny

[Duggeh]

Were they still bass light with a tiny sweet spot in your own setup? The scale picture with your dad next to them is pretty cool.

No, proper room filling low end, with a good bit of whack. Got too much with the bass on +3dB. Very different to the 21L low end though. Sweet spot still narrow but not microscopic. Took a bit of experimentation with the toe-in. They were firing straight on in the shop and were further apart too.

[spritzer]

Those are some proper, manly speakers which make amps run and hide.

[Duggeh]

They only work with smoke powered amps, and once the smoke gets out of the case, the speakers stop making sound.

[aerius]

Your room isn't nearly as big as I imagined it to be, it slipped my mind that houses & room over here in North America are generally far larger than those in the UK, so when I read "large room" I was thinking of something around twice the size of the room depicted in your photos.

This opens up a lot of possibilities, the Living Voice Avatar is back in the game, to me it's a Quad ESL-57 with a slightly warmer balance which can play a fair bit louder. It's also pretty efficient & easy to drive, 30-50W is likely all you'll ever need. You could likely get away with ESL-63's as well, though volume might be a tad limited.