JH Audio stuffs

[manaox2]

I feel like I got my JH13 shot with my custom IEM experience previously. I get and understand they are ridiculously good, but I don't know if I would get them now even if they were less then $900. Many of their upsides are also their biggest flaws for me (custom (IE fit concerns), small (IE fragile, stolen/lost), isolation (IE antisocial enablers)). I have made up my mind to go to O2mk1, likely exStata, and a nice source one day and then move on to speakers before going back to into high-end portable audio (but damn is the PICO slim tempting somehow still). Those who have the money to afford these with a proper fit and the previously mentioned are very lucky in my book, I would love to be in that position.

[MexicanDragon]

Even if he comes up with the JH-18, the JH-13 won't suddenly start sounding bad. It'll still be awesome.

That's what I'm thinking, and as someone once told me "OMGWTFBBQ is good enough" (in reference to the JH13s, of course).

I just wonder what happens 3 years down the road when say, an armature comes dislodged, or if something goes wrong in 5 years. Is there a stated or implied warranty?

As I've said, I'm all for selling my matching #s HF-1/2 combo to get the JH13s... they fit my needs better than anything else out there right now. I think I'd actually listen more if I had them (as long as I still have time to do that). I hardly use my iPod, even at the gym, but I'm at the computer a good bit. HF-2s are a bit cumbersome to listen to sitting on the couch having to use an adapter straight out of the comp, but IEMs are great.

I know some people have said they are better than O2s and I know at least one person who's said they prefer them to R10s as well.

Eh... I guess I can look at them not being future proof by saying "for now, I have HF-1 and HF-2. There are (to some) better Grados out there, but they go for 4-7 times as much $$$ and they aren't 4-7 times better. I don't NEED them, just kinda want to hear 'em." JH13s are ridiculous. After listening to them, I heard really good headphones and I thought they sounded "meh" at best afterwards.

I still can't believe I'm even considering getting these... I hate seeing this thread bumped...

Oh well, I'll probably wind up waiting on the CF carrying case. Also, does anyone know how much spare cables are? Say, one 48" and one 64"?

**BRENT**

P.S. I'd also miss letting the kids listen when they come up and I'm listening to headphones. Being able to let them listen to something I'm enjoying... well... that's fun. Oh well, that's what PX100s are for, right?

Edited October 6, 2009 by MexicanDragon

[Dreadhead]

The only thing that gives me hope is that a lot of the reviews of this headphone don't make any sense to me. For example comparing O2s to R10s is like comparing kumquats to pineapples (other than they are both expensive (or fruit)). That and a lot of the people who really really like them and I disagree on what sound we are looking for. That said they know good when they hear it and are very respectable....

So either I need to stop reading this thread or I need to go somewhere and hear these things because this is causing my mind to wander a lot

[Voltron]

So much funboyism from people with accredited knowledge and good taste in sound reproduction make those things desirable. However I'm not into the customs thing for many reasons.

Anyone knows if at some point they'll be released in universal form factor?

I'm not sure why you don't want to go custom, Antonio, but I have been making a lot of cross-country trips with lately and the change in comfort alone from Shure E500s to the JH|13 is worth a lot to me. I can have them in for 6+ hours without any discomfort or irritation, etc, and I could never say that about the UE and Shure universals I have had. Plus, it is simply the best sound I have heard from an IEM, so there's that too.

[Augsburger]

For me it is or will be- out and about, traveling/flying the JH13s and my LaRocco PRII,

- Home watching the sunset or chilling in the evening, my speaker rig,

-Late evening in bed or when the chief demands household silence, headphone rig.

I still use my headphone rig regularly and don't foresee that ever changing. I will probably buy the Audeze LD2 instead of the HD800's, but that is a decision to be made next year. I am not really concerned about Jerry coming up with something better than the Pro13s because I am pretty sure this will be it for me on the IEM journey. The Pro13s are great now and as Duggeh says anything new won't make these suck.

[Torpedo]

I'm not sure why you don't want to go custom, Antonio, but I have been making a lot of cross-country trips with lately and the change in comfort alone from Shure E500s to the JH|13 is worth a lot to me. I can have them in for 6+ hours without any discomfort or irritation, etc, and I could never say that about the UE and Shure universals I have had. Plus, it is simply the best sound I have heard from an IEM, so there's that too.

I have commented some of those reasons before. They mostly have to do with two things, the impracticality of having the IEMs made in the USA and living in Europe, which makes any fitting issues, repairs, etc an expensive and time consuming affair, and hygienic reasons. I've seen at work all long term complications that hearing aids (using the same type of in ear molds the customs have) produce. Supposing I'm careful and I clean the molds frequently, and never fit the phones if the ear canals are wet or suffering the slightest condition, still those hard devices, despite comfy, stimulate wax production and act in the same way as Qtips do, they push the wax way into the canal, close to the drum. Though I have many otologists at work who could clean my ears with good care, I still prefer not to need that.

Soft tips and a more external fit, would prevent those issues, hence my preference for universals albeit I know they won't isolate the same, and possibly won't give the same performance.

Then there's the curiosity for knowing how good they are...

Anyway, I don't think JH will make them in an universal format, since at his site he seems to be stick to the benefits of custom fit. We'll see

[Dusty Chalk]

I'm not sure I disagree with you, but considering there are demos of the universal format, I would hope that he would realize the market for that and make them available. I suspect he'll just wait until the rush for the customs is down a bit. That would be the smart (marketing-wise) thing to do, IMHO.

[Dusty Chalk]

Personally, after re-acquiring decent headphone rigs, I remembered precisely why I ended up selling my headphone gears in the past - I was listening to music either through my speakers or via Etys, with regular headphones getting virtually no time.

See, I'm just the opposite -- I hardly ever listen to IEM's, that's why I'm nowhere near as tempted as these other people.

That said, I could see how the multi-driver situation wouldn't translate well to full-size headphones, so it'd be a sound I wouldn't be able to get elsewhere, other than speakers. Hmmm...

The thought is crossing my mind. Not "la-la-la" frustrated yet, but ... intrigued is too strong a word...interest is finally piqued?

[darthsilverice]

I used to be an only IEM guy and even now IEM still plays a big part in my life.

Reading through this thread makes me want to sell my HD555+HD600+incoming Glite + shure SE530 to make some money for this...

NTS: Stay away from this thread....stay far far away....

I'm not sure I disagree with you, but considering there are demos of the universal format, I would hope that he would realize the market for that and make them available. I suspect he'll just wait until the rush for the customs is down a bit. That would be the smart (marketing-wise) thing to do, IMHO.

Universals would make it more attractive to me(and maybe many others) because I would have the option of selling it and get back most of what I paid for.

[Torpedo]

I'm not sure I disagree with you, but considering there are demos of the universal format, I would hope that he would realize the market for that and make them available. I suspect he'll just wait until the rush for the customs is down a bit. That would be the smart (marketing-wise) thing to do, IMHO.

I agree. I have the impression that many people outside the US is interested in JH phones, but all the customization process is holding them up to get a pair. If they were available "plug&play" I think they'd get many overseas orders. Maybe if the sales of customs drops they explore that market.

Do the universals sound significantly different from the customs? I suppose there are isolation differences, and maybe less bass...

[Hopstretch]

... and maybe less bass ...

Which might not be a bad thing? (Runs away.)

[Dusty Chalk]

He could always compensate for less bass by putting a hump in.

JH: Mah humps, mah humps...

[Edwood]

I returned a pair of $1400 full sized cans that didn't Measure up to $1100 IEM's.

[The Monkey]

Heh...who would ever do such a thing?

[boomana]

[wet blanket]

Do they sound better than other $1100 headphones?

Yes, they do. I'm not going to go as far as to say that they sound better than my O2MK1s. They don't, but that's specifically in my rig. If we're going to talk price and value, let's look at the whole picture:

O2MK1 (used) $1300, BHSE $5500, APL Phillips (used) $1300, ICs $60 = $8160.

JH13s (CJ discount) $1000, iphone (had it anyway).

The JH13s come amazingly close to reproducing much what I sold off most of my previously owned gear to hear in the O2MK1/BHSE rig. I haven't yet messed around with different amps/sources enough with the JH13s to say anything about their full potential, but imo, even with just an iphone, I can only think of a couple rigs that better the JH13s in pretty much every area that's important to me when listening with headphones (tone, imaging, attack, etc.), and those few rigs cost thousands more than the JH13s.

Right now everyone says yes, but seriously what happens when Jerry (or whomever) launches the next great audio earpiece that has 8 double-stuffed drivers for super extra awesome yummy goodness? For folks that spend a ton of time listening to IEMs I get it but for everyday headphones, no fracken way. Ok, enough out of me.[/wet blanket]

I'm with tyrion on that one. Knowing me I'll be curious, but I can't see myself being disappointed in anything that I'm hearing in the JH13s, and as I've said before, when good enough is actually great, I'm far less inclined to leap into that last 10% or 5% or whatever. I'm more curious about source developments, watching technology like the HiFiMan 801 (which I loved at CanJam, but not yet what I'm looking for), to see where that goes, and how to bring out the potential of these little iems, rather than upgrading the iems themselves.

[catscratch]

I'm not sure I disagree with you, but considering there are demos of the universal format, I would hope that he would realize the market for that and make them available. I suspect he'll just wait until the rush for the customs is down a bit. That would be the smart (marketing-wise) thing to do, IMHO.

This would be a logical next step, but having had both the UM2 and ES2, which share the same drivers, I can say that the custom fit makes as big a difference in the sound as the drivers used, if not more so. I wouldn't expect a universal-fit JH13 to be anywhere near the custom. Too bad that I didn't get to hear the universal-fit demo.

it also makes it possible to get all the way up to 20khz, which seems to be more important than I would have thought. Maybe not, but something is going on.

It is important. There may not be much directly audible information past 15khz or so but overtones and harmonics matter greatly to tone, and if you overlay a tone that's past the range of hearing on top of a tone that you can hear, you will hear a difference. Not being able to reach 20khz definitely hurts your ability to portray tone correctly.

... what happens when Jerry (or whomever) launches the next great audio earpiece that has 8 double-stuffed drivers for super extra awesome yummy goodness?

We'll suck it up and buy it, and then rave about how awesome it is.

Considering how quickly balanced armatures are improving, or at the very least how quickly their implementation is improving, we will probably see newer and better customs come out on a regular basis, and the prospect of how far the technology can go is pretty exciting.

[penger]

I'm not sure I disagree with you, but considering there are demos of the universal format, I would hope that he would realize the market for that and make them available. I suspect he'll just wait until the rush for the customs is down a bit. That would be the smart (marketing-wise) thing to do, IMHO.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but at the Norcal meet, the universals weren't what you would traditionally think of universals. They look like molded customs and there were disposable sleeves that you could stick on the outcropping that would normally go into your ear.

[Dusty Chalk]

Someone else will have to correct you, I haven't actually seen the universals. Boomana? Duggeh? I know you two played around with the pair that Ms. Harvey sent you.

[Sherwood]

The universals he had at RMAF were like modified customs, but that's not to say he couldn't make one if demand warranted it. I wouldn't imagine he'll skimp on universals entirely, Dusty, though you may never see the JH13 in a universal, much like you never saw the UE11 in a universal.

[The Monkey]

Yes, they do. I'm not going to go as far as to say that they sound better than my O2MK1s.

At DJ, when I took a timeout from slurping down beerce, I snatched the JH13 universals. I have a foggy recollection of them looking somewhat like penger's description. I also recall, with more clarity, saying (slurring?) to Vicki, "These sound like the O2."

[jp11801]

I agree. I have the impression that many people outside the US is interested in JH phones, but all the customization process is holding them up to get a pair. If they were available "plug&play" I think they'd get many overseas orders. Maybe if the sales of customs drops they explore that market.

Do the universals sound significantly different from the customs? I suppose there are isolation differences, and maybe less bass...

While Jerry has not shared detailed information regarding sales by country I do know that the Asian market for these is substantial and the thought of custom IEM and potential hassles have not slowed them down.

I asked about universals and Jerry seemed pretty adamant about not going down that route. You never know but I wouldn't hold my breath.

[Voltron]

The JH|13 demos are NOT universals that could be marketed and sold. As penger describes, they are effectively a custom molded monitor but with a smaller nozzle that you can fit a foamy over (so long as you press it on vigorously and push the nozzle through it). That is not something that could easily translate into a true universal fit design.

[jinp6301]

I'm sure if they wanted to make a universal (which they dont seem to want), it could be done

[The Monkey]

I'm sure if they wanted to make a universal (which they dont seem to want), it could be done

Impossible!

[Voltron]

Anything is possible. The point is that they just haven't taken any steps in that direction.