AMR CD-77 vs. Reimyo CDP-777

[909]

heard the AMR CD-77 this morning. a/b'd it with the reimyo -- brief impressions to follow...

[Rob N]

Interested to know what you thought

[DigiPete]

The AMR certainly is a very nice looking unit.

[Augsburger]

Well 909 it's been three hours, so wassup???

[909]

i've worked hard this weekend -- listened to the APL NWO 3.0-GO on Friday into the wee morning hours then today spent the morning with friends and the AMR CD-77 and my Reimyo CDP-777. actually my time with the CD-77 was seriously limited because the purpose of this audition was for my friend's benefit as he is in the market for a source and i couldn't stay that long. plus we had a ground loop issue that held up listen for about an hour.

a little background story, after my friend heard my Reimyo for the first time he liked it so much he wanted to buy one, yet never venturing down this road before and being a prudent audiophile he wanted to listen to other sources. i believe to date he has heard the Ayre C-5xe, Meridian 808.2, Emm Labs CDSA, Esoteric X-01 and finally today the CD-77 -- all with his rig and headphones. during this process he revisited the Reimyo two other times, which included today's session. after he heard each player, i'd hear his listening impressions and to be frank i was surprise as good as those other players are and are considered in the pro reviews and audio community he still continued to like the Reimyo. today was the final showdown as the CD-77 was the last player on his list.

i listened to just one track, A Day In The Life off the Beatles' Sgt. Pepper -- once on the AMR then the Reimyo and back to the AMR for the first two minutes of the track to mess around with the oversampling and the upsampling. my friend has a balanced Zana Deux, but i could only listen singled-ended with my L3000s so that's what i did.

before i get to my limited impressions, let me say the look and build quality of the CD-77 is mighty impressive. everything just exudes quality from the remote to the chassis to the transport -- the buttons on the front panel are touch sensitive with a blue LCD backdrop lighting, upon a finger swipe or ginger touch they light before you even press a button. the remote is predominately metal with AMR engraved near the bottom and the touch screen lights up blue when held, though, this particular remote didn't have immediate responsiveness. the metal workmanship is truly exquisite not only to the eye, but to the touch as well. the color is a little darker than my photos depict, which i can't say how much i really liked the color -- freaking awesome. the entire transport was spring loaded so when you touch it, it works a bit like a shock absorber platform -- i don't believe i've ever seen this design choice in a cdp before. additionally, the little green dot is a mini-level, which was pretty neat. the puck was nice, but seemed thin especially in comparison to the overall unit and my Reimyo's. the sliding metal lid over the transport operated so easily and exceedingly smooth, unfortunately the Reimyo doesn't slide as well. in all i thought the AMR CD-77 is the finest looking cdp i've had the pleasure to experience up close. it also comes with an awesome pelican like flight case. as of this month the price on these units increased by something like 30% and what else -- it's made in china and it's got a USB input, which the Reimyo does not.

ok, now the serious stuff -- sound. on first listen i didn't do oversampling or upsampling, but still within seconds, the CD-77 made it abundantly clear it's ability to extract a ton of info off the disc making certain micro details slightly more easily discernible than on the Reimyo. further the CD-77 leans into the analytic realm with slightly more treble extension and air while also offering more separation between the instruments plus the presentation is somewhat dry overall, though it still retains a wonderful musicality and smoothness. it did just so many things spot on such as but not limited to tone, speed, control, timing, focus and dynamics. considering my limiting listening session and more time could provide better founded conclusions, my ear detected a slight heat or hotness in the treble region. granted most people wouldn't notice this, but if sensitive to it or after longer listening session it could be an issue for some. another concern that would likely require more assimilation to the CD-77 sound is my reference male vocal track didn't sound wholly natural to my ear and possibly this could be limited to just male voice, which i not only felt sounded a bit dry, but also an extremely minor and i mean minor sizzle like quality in the high frequencies. beyond these concerns and given my reference source the CD-77 seemed a bit mechanical and not as involving in comparison. one other thing worth noting, i felt the CD-77 didn't reach as deep, though, had slightly more control than the Reimyo. i make absolutely no apologize that i prefer the Reimyo and not by a small margin either, but i wouldn't be so arrogant to think that within the fifteen minutes i spent listening to the CD-77 my ear warmed to its sound signature plus it's new and only has about two weeks of constant play time on it. in all fairness, my Reimyo hasn't been used in weeks and only had about two hours on it whereas the CD-77 had been powered on for a week. regardless and without any hesitation, the Reimyo is just pointblank so much more organic, musical and natural sounding to my ear. it provides a far more euphoric, involving and bitingly emotional listening experience. it hate to say it because it sounds silly, but the Reimyo has this magical type quality -- it's got a soul. i could go on about the reimyo's virtues, but that's been done. don't get me wrong, i think the CD-77 is one of the finest cdp i've heard, but i am not going for this hi-fi analytical sound, and granted the CD-77 isn't overly analytic at all, but in comparison to the CDP-777 it sure seemed that way.

[zippy2001]

Nice write up, it makes me want to spend some quality time listening to your rig. The AMR and Reimyo are both nice looking CDPs.

Does your friend share your feelings as to the sound of both these sources?

[Rob N]

Interesting,I didn

[Jon L]

I really don't know why people continue to throw the kitchen sink and $$$ to these TDA15xx DAC chips. Sure, they can be made to sound great with certain, eh "character," but imagine what kind of stupendous results one would achieve by throwing the same amount of effort and money at something like the ESS Sabre DAC chips, for example.

[deepak]

I really don't know why people continue to throw the kitchen sink and $$$ to these TDA15xx DAC chips. Sure, they can be made to sound great with certain, eh "character," but imagine what kind of stupendous results one would achieve by throwing the same amount of effort and money at something like the ESS Sabre DAC chips, for example.

Just curious why you think the TDAs aren't worthy and something relatively new like the Sabre would be?

[Pars]

There are alot of people who think that the best ladder DACs are far better than any delta sigma DAC made. Its important to realize that one of the biggest reasons most chip makers don't do ladder DACs is the cost of the resistor trimming/matching. I am somewhat surprised to see a present day commercial CDP based upon a chip that is difficult to obtain... must say something about the quantity of units they expect to sell. I know Jocko hates the TDA1541a, but alot of people still really like it.

[Rob N]

AMR are hoping to sell around 2000-2500 units worldwide

[Jon L]

Just curious why you think the TDAs aren't worthy and something relatively new like the Sabre would be?

Mainly because I own/have owned TDA1541 and TDA1543 based DAC's and have listened to others. Mind you I'm not saying they don't sound great (at least in thought-out designs that accentuate their strengths and minimize their limitations) or unworthy. But as the overall resolution of your system continues to go higher (aka electrostats) and great recordings with complex material is used, one can more easily discern certain limitations.

If I were going to seek state-of-art assault on digital and throw this kind of money into it, I personally would not go the TDA15xx route.

[luvdunhill]

I love TDA1543 the TDA1541A chips. I'd argue they're best with electrostatic setups. Whatever though.

[909]

Nice write up, it makes me want to spend some quality time listening to your rig. The AMR and Reimyo are both nice looking CDPs.

Does your friend share your feelings as to the sound of both these sources?

thanks, Steve. you might just get that chance on the 10.18.08 as the dealer seems willing to bring the CD-77 to our headphone meet. my friend (aka dreamcomposer) does share similar impressions about each source. he seems now poised to buy a CDP-777 and by the way he's actually a composer so he's ears are well-trained.

Interesting,I didn’t find the CD77 analytical (although I haven’t heard the Reimyo) compared to my MF trivista or Marantz CD12 and the Ensemble Dirondo 2 box (UK price

[luvdunhill]

There are alot of people who think that the best ladder DACs are far better than any delta sigma DAC made. Its important to realize that one of the biggest reasons most chip makers don't do ladder DACs is the cost of the resistor trimming/matching.

When you say ladder, you mean R-2R ladder DACs?

I say ladder > sign magnitude > delta sigma > everything else

[spritzer]

I love TDA1543 the TDA1541A chips. I'd argue they're best with electrostatic setups. Whatever though.

They certainly aren't bad and I love my "obsolete" dac's. The APL isn't all that bad though

[Rob N]

i believe it was on digital master II as that's what it was on before i listened earlier in the day, but didn't double check when the dealer cued the track.

I listen to Digital Master I more than II

[luvdunhill]

i really gotta think that implementation matters more than the actual dac type. any technology has its strengths and weaknesses, which have to be played up and down, respectively.

yup, so true.

[luvdunhill]

does that mean that i'm a professional engineer, now?

you mean this kind:

Professional Engineer - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

or -=this=- kind?

[909]

I listen to Digital Master I more than II

well i should hear it again in about a month at the headphone meet i am hosting so i'll be sure to listen to both settings.

[Rob N]

Can you still buy the Reimyo? I thought it was discontinued

[909]

you are correct the CDP-777 has been discounted and that was not purely by choice, but necessity and lack of future availability of new XRCD transports from JVC since they're not willing to fix the machine that makes them as they have enough on hand and JVC and Reimyo have enough to service the units in use. he'll have to buy used, which isn't such a bad thing as the price is substantially discounted and, in fact, based on my research not one CDP-777 has required service yet or at least due to normal use.

[blubliss]

There is a new Reimyo dac coming out soon which could be promising.

REIMYO DAP-999EX Digital Audio Processor

Thread over here:

http://www.head-fi.org/forums/f113/reimyo-dap999-ex-new-24-bit-k2-dac-363419/

[Rob N]

How does the AMR compare to the other CD players you/your friend have tried?

[deepak]

Mainly because I own/have owned TDA1541 and TDA1543 based DAC's and have listened to others. Mind you I'm not saying they don't sound great (at least in thought-out designs that accentuate their strengths and minimize their limitations) or unworthy. But as the overall resolution of your system continues to go higher (aka electrostats) and great recordings with complex material is used, one can more easily discern certain limitations.

If I were going to seek state-of-art assault on digital and throw this kind of money into it, I personally would not go the TDA15xx route.

That's a reasonable explanation. I suppose I should have focused on why the Sabre DAC, as it's so new and there really aren't that many implementations now...

6moons review of the AMR CD-77, which from what I understand the reviewer concluded it had a pretty weighty sound http://6moons.com/audioreviews/abbingdon/abbingdon.html

Edited September 15, 2008 by deepak