n_maher Posted July 15, 2008 Author Report Posted July 15, 2008 Youre time is worth $0 to you? No, he said cost not worth.
grawk Posted July 15, 2008 Report Posted July 15, 2008 It's all a matter of scale. If you don't like the price, don't pay it. If a buyer and seller come to an arrangement, and it's more than you'd pay, that doesn't make the seller a con artist.
n_maher Posted July 15, 2008 Author Report Posted July 15, 2008 It's all a matter of scale. If you don't like the price, don't pay it. If a buyer and seller come to an arrangement, and it's more than you'd pay, that doesn't make the seller a con artist. Dan, maybe you don't think so but I do agree that there is certainly a point of predatory pricing. I'm not sure Mikhail is there (or Ray for that matter) but both seem to like to push the bounds of what would be considered the typical industry markup. I don't begrudge either really, except in the case of Mikhail where service and quality clearly are falling out of line with price. Like or dislike Ray, he bends over backwards for his customers and provides top notch service.
JBLoudG20 Posted July 15, 2008 Report Posted July 15, 2008 I'm with Dan on this one. If the buyer is willing to pay a price you name, then by all means. Both parties remain happy. The W3000 I built is a decent example. I sourced the parts, built the headphone. I had about one hour of my time invested in it. I sold it at a $700 profit. For all intents and purposes, I sold my time for $700/hr. The buyer was more than happy to pay my price, and we both walked away happy. What's wrong with that?
grawk Posted July 15, 2008 Report Posted July 15, 2008 Lots of things are expensive just to be exclusive. Some people like paying for exclusivity. Who's to say they're wrong to do so, if it makes them happy?
n_maher Posted July 15, 2008 Author Report Posted July 15, 2008 Lots of things are expensive just to be exclusive. Some people like paying for exclusivity. Who's to say they're wrong to do so, if it makes them happy? I'm not trying to convince you that my way of thinking is correct, only express my alternate view. Example: unknowning buyer walks into a car dealership and wants to buy a car. Car salesman seizes opportunity and charges more than car is worth. See, I have an issue with that. Taking advantage of someone's ignorance at some level just doesn't sit well with me and strikes me as pretty close to dishonesty. If that doesn't bug you, so be it, just be prepared to reap what you sow.
JBLoudG20 Posted July 15, 2008 Report Posted July 15, 2008 I'm not trying to convince you that my way of thinking is correct, only express my alternate view. Example: unknowning buyer walks into a car dealership and wants to buy a car. Car salesman seizes opportunity and charges more than car is worth. See, I have an issue with that. Taking advantage of someone's ignorance at some level just doesn't sit well with me and strikes me as pretty close to dishonesty. If that doesn't bug you, so be it, just be prepared to reap what you sow. I tend to classify ignorance differently than strictly price gouging. Exclusivity, as Dan points out, is a great motivator for increased price. Look at the K1000. One could argue that it is the buyer's responsibility to know what he/she is paying for. I don't subscribe to this belief, but there is that side of the coin.
spritzer Posted July 15, 2008 Report Posted July 15, 2008 BH supplies are very convenient to have spares of laying around. They will run just about everytning. Of course there is something new and much more trendy. How do you think one will fair in an Egmont.
Knuckledragger Posted July 15, 2008 Report Posted July 15, 2008 50 year old Macallan (1952) $520 50 year old Macallan (1940) $2000 As above, in fancy container. $10,000 As above, in ridiculous container. According to this, that last one is over $167,000. I have trouble believing that.
luvdunhill Posted July 15, 2008 Report Posted July 15, 2008 I'm not trying to convince you that my way of thinking is correct, only express my alternate view. Example: unknowning buyer walks into a car dealership and wants to buy a car. Car salesman seizes opportunity and charges more than car is worth. See, I have an issue with that. Taking advantage of someone's ignorance at some level just doesn't sit well with me and strikes me as pretty close to dishonesty. If that doesn't bug you, so be it, just be prepared to reap what you sow. The example would better be if it went like this: a buyer walks into a car dealership and looks up the guy who sold him his last 2 cars, and sold cars to 2 of his close friends. Car salesman then charges more than car is worth.
909 Posted July 15, 2008 Report Posted July 15, 2008 there are many studies that show unequivocally that price influences opinion -- generally if something costs more it is easily perceived to be better and also provides a feeling of elusively for the affluent purchaser. the most recent study i have read pertains to wines in which they surveyed those drinking two glasses of wine. the first sample showed the prices to the drinkers, say a $15 bottle verse a $100. nearly everyone preferred the more expensive wine. the second sample switched the prices. again nearly everyone preferred the more expensive wine, though, it was actually the $15 bottle. the third didn't provide any prices and preferences were pretty much equally split between the two bottles with slightly more picking the less expensive wine. --- when you get into the SP high end Mikhail's prices seem high, but I don't fault him for attempting to charge as much as he can. i also believe that when Mikhail does custom builds it requires more trial and error on his part before he arrives at something he considers a finished product that he is content sending to the customer. What really surprises me about this whole fiasco is how long our community has appeased the situation and supported him in light of his actions. granted Mikhail is a great guy and super nice, yet that shouldn't counteract unreasonable business practices. imo, his appeasers have perpetuated this problem and not only prolonged what seemed inevitable, it all coming to a head, but also put more customers and money at risk. i think we should call it what it is -- Mikhail lies to his customers. he lies about delivery times and that it has shipped. i have heard it first hand, all too often -- so it can't be consider anything other then a standard practice. second, too many SP amps arrive with problems or exhibit problems later on. these things are inexcusable and have been going on for years. finally, his build quality and design implementation are questionable. it's unfortunate how long it has taken the community to wake up and open their eyes.
luvdunhill Posted July 15, 2008 Report Posted July 15, 2008 Is that first thing a cryo vat? it's used for the "Kevin Gilmore Cryo Challenge"
guzziguy Posted July 15, 2008 Report Posted July 15, 2008 I've opened my Platinum Extreme and taken some pictures. I see no real problems in my Extreme, just a couple of solder joints that could be better and some flux that could have been cleaned away. But I see nothing to make me nervous. BTW, there is no FET in an Extreme. Here are links to the pictures. Be aware that each is 6 MB resolution. The first is a general shot with flash. The Plitron xformer is on the other side of the board in the upper right. overall shot with flash overall, no flash area near transformer output section from left side
deepak Posted July 15, 2008 Report Posted July 15, 2008 I think Photobucket auto-resized those images to 640x480.
guzziguy Posted July 15, 2008 Report Posted July 15, 2008 I'm afraid so. If anybody wants the high resolution pictures, let me know and I'll email them. Can I host them here? If so, please tell me how.
kevin gilmore Posted July 15, 2008 Report Posted July 15, 2008 yep, pretty low resolution. If you need a place to put the pictures email them to me. Look at the resistor labeled mexico in the first picture on the right side next to the one capacitor. Does seem like some definite burning below that resistor. Or the camera may be playing tricks. Looks to be the original version of the extreme made from a ppx3 circuit board. I'm pretty sure that some of the extremes did have a regulated power supply... Gotta find that picture.
tkam Posted July 15, 2008 Report Posted July 15, 2008 I'm afraid so. If anybody wants the high resolution pictures, let me know and I'll email them. Can I host them here? If so, please tell me how. User CP -> pictures and albums. Just add your own, and when you've uploaded the images it'll give you direct links to them for posting. Depending on the size of the pics you might have to upload them one or two at a time.
guzziguy Posted July 15, 2008 Report Posted July 15, 2008 User CP -> pictures and albums. This may be a moderator only function. When I go to the User CP page, there is no "pictures and albums" button. The only thing I can see having to do with pictures is "edit profile picture". yep, pretty low resolution. If you need a place to put the pictures email them to me. Look at the resistor labeled mexico in the first picture on the right side next to the one capacitor. Does seem like some definite burning below that resistor. Or the camera may be playing tricks. Looks to be the original version of the extreme made from a ppx3 circuit board. I'm pretty sure that some of the extremes did have a regulated power supply... Gotta find that picture. This is definitely a ppx3 board based implementation. I looked at that area (I think that component is a diode by the board labeling) earlier. There is a lot of flux left over. However, I just looked closer and it definitely shows burning. This may be my fault though. I was warned to use 6528 tubes for only a couple of hours at a time. I may have over done it. Sorry about not noticing the burn marks earlier, I don't have a lot of experience looking at boards. That's one reason I want to get the external power supply.
tkam Posted July 16, 2008 Report Posted July 16, 2008 This may be a moderator only function. When I go to the User CP page, there is no "pictures and albums" button. The only thing I can see having to do with pictures is "edit profile picture". Nope it's not, one of the other admins broke that particular permission on a few user groups. It's all set now though.
JBLoudG20 Posted July 16, 2008 Report Posted July 16, 2008 I'm staying out of the finger pointing, my ass is already burning form teh beatings I have received lately
aardvark baguette Posted July 16, 2008 Report Posted July 16, 2008 I'm staying out of the finger pointing, my ass is already burning form teh beatings I have received lately So many potential jokes....
guzziguy Posted July 16, 2008 Report Posted July 16, 2008 full board with flash full board without flash power section with scorched board output section
amb Posted July 16, 2008 Report Posted July 16, 2008 I really dislike negative comments about someone else's work, but the wiring to the IEC and bridge rectifier mounted on the panel look like something done by a first-time DIYer. The uninsulated AC mains wiring is not cool. I have an issue with sloppy work like like, especially in an expensive commercial product. He could have at least used some heat-shrink tubing.
grawk Posted July 16, 2008 Report Posted July 16, 2008 Tom Hankins apparently got his amp yesterday, and is happy with it.
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