tyrion Posted January 5, 2008 Report Share Posted January 5, 2008 well yes and no it is meant to be very transportable and would function in a similar fashion to the pico with a laptop. The Duet is really meant for musicians that record through an apple computer and it's ins/outs are set up for that purpose as is the firewire power solution so you can run off the laptops battery while recording. The fact that our hobby can use it is a cool happenstance as it was not designed with our community in mind it was made for the recoding musician. This makes it really easy to record anywhere all you need is a mike and you can lay down multitrac recordings sans power outlet. It can be used just like the Pico, but in a bigger form factor with more wires all over until someone builds an cable that will eliminate all the ones that are not needed for our purposes. But I agree it can be used the same as the Pico for headphone listening on the go using a notebook. As I said before, the Pico is likely to have a better headphone amplifier. This and whether it's a better DAC remain to be seen. For me, the Pico will be my traveling partner either way. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jp11801 Posted January 5, 2008 Author Report Share Posted January 5, 2008 Mike get busy and start doing the three way comparo Duet/Cosecant/Pico get off your ass well maybe sit on your ass but just get started on this Who is going to build a high quality breakout cable with bling rca cables Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
boomana Posted January 5, 2008 Report Share Posted January 5, 2008 John, what happened to your commitment to not buy any audio gear in 2008? Broken so soon? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jp11801 Posted January 5, 2008 Author Report Share Posted January 5, 2008 John, what happened to your commitment to not buy any audio gear in 2008? Broken so soon? bought this new years eve Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
boomana Posted January 5, 2008 Report Share Posted January 5, 2008 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jp11801 Posted January 5, 2008 Author Report Share Posted January 5, 2008 I did technically cheat though I bought a guitar on the 1st after having the meet to buy the guitar cancelled on the 31st but the money came out of the atm on the 31st?? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tyrion Posted January 5, 2008 Report Share Posted January 5, 2008 Mike get busy and start doing the three way comparo Duet/Cosecant/Pico get off your ass well maybe sit on your ass but just get started on this Who is going to build a high quality breakout cable with bling rca cables That's what I've been doing since 9:30 this morning. I don't have the Pico yet. The biggest difference is in the low end. The Duet definitely goes lower. It's not a subtle difference ether. Right now I'm going Berendsen IPA 80 pre > Berendsen STA 150 amp > SA Rangers. Over the Hills and Far Away, at about 1:27 into the song when everything kicks in, the bass just kills with Duet. I want to say that the Cosecant sounds thinner because of this. In terms of soundstage I'm thinking about the same but the depth seems better with the Duet. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tyrion Posted January 6, 2008 Report Share Posted January 6, 2008 I picked up a sound level meter today and was able to equalize the volume between the Cosecant and the Duet. I used a Cardas Burn In Sweep to match the volume. The Duet has the higher output. The volume control on the integrated has a digital readout so it was easy to figure out how to equalize the volume for the two sources. As I've said before, the biggest difference between the two is the bass response. There is no question, now that the volume is balanced between the sources, the bass goes deeper with the Duet. It's more palpable from the Duet. The Cosecant has a bit dryer sound. With less bass prominence, it seems to take away from the depth of the image. The mids seem about the same with some more warmth from the Duet. The highs seem to be fairly close. I don't think the warmth of the Duet is due to any high end roll off. If there was, I'm not picking it up. I put on So What to see if either source picks up the cough you can hear at 9 seconds in any better. Both picked it up and it was pretty even. I've been just listening to the Duet and thinking whether I can live with the sound I'm hearing if this was my source and the answer is yes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tyrion Posted January 6, 2008 Report Share Posted January 6, 2008 that's pretty impressive performance. The test for me will be to see what others hear at Voltron's meet. But it will have to be in a quiet room, not under meet conditions. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
boomana Posted January 6, 2008 Report Share Posted January 6, 2008 Didn't Al say we'd have a K1000 room? I'm very interested in checking this out. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tyrion Posted January 6, 2008 Report Share Posted January 6, 2008 Didn't Al say we'd have a K1000 room? I'm very interested in checking this out. I'll make sure to bring my K1000s. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
guzziguy Posted January 6, 2008 Report Share Posted January 6, 2008 The test for me will be to see what others hear at Voltron's meet. But it will have to be in a quiet room, not under meet conditions. We can do that after everybody leaves. Wait a minute, nobody is leaving. Uh oh! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
immtbiker Posted January 6, 2008 Report Share Posted January 6, 2008 I picked up a sound level meter today and was able to equalize the volume between the Cosecant and the Duet. I used a Cardas Burn In Sweep to match the volume. The Duet has the higher output. The volume control on the integrated has a digital readout so it was easy to figure out how to equalize the volume for the two sources. As I've said before, the biggest difference between the two is the bass response. There is no question, now that the volume is balanced between the sources, the bass goes deeper with the Duet. It's more palpable from the Duet. The Cosecant has a bit dryer sound. With less bass prominence, it seems to take away from the depth of the image. The mids seem about the same with some more warmth from the Duet. The highs seem to be fairly close. I don't think the warmth of the Duet is due to any high end roll off. If there was, I'm not picking it up. I put on So What to see if either source picks up the cough you can hear at 9 seconds in any better. Both picked it up and it was pretty even. I've been just listening to the Duet and thinking whether I can live with the sound I'm hearing if this was my source and the answer is yes. Is this with speakers or headphones? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tyrion Posted January 6, 2008 Report Share Posted January 6, 2008 Is this with speakers or headphones? This was using 650s/Grand Enigma cable/Berendsen IPA 80 headphone out. I will have a 600/Lambda Pro/MPX3/007t this week to try it with as well. Today I will check the volume matching with my speakers (should be the same). I need to try some cans that aren't quite as bass heavy as the 650s are. I am not saying yet the Duet is better than the Cosecant but they certainly are different. Some of what I'm saying seems to be consistent with jp's findings. When I compared the Pico to the Predator, I felt the Pico had a more refined hifi sound. It was the more balanced dac/amp combo. I'm thinking that might be the case hear, that the Cosecant is more balanced and refined. I'm trying not to let the relative cost of the two items influence my findings. I wanted qualify my earlier statements. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jp11801 Posted January 6, 2008 Author Report Share Posted January 6, 2008 I am not saying yet the Duet is better than the Cosecant but they certainly are different. Some of what I'm saying seems to be consistent with jp's findings. When I compared the Pico to the Predator, I felt the Pico had a more refined hifi sound. It was the more balanced dac/amp combo. I'm thinking that might be the case hear, that the Cosecant is more balanced and refined. I'm trying not to let the relative cost of the two items influence my findings. I wanted qualify my earlier statements. to me the duet has deeper bass, potentially better detail and images better than the cosecant and the cosecant provides vocals and instruments in the midrange with more body and warmth. Mike you and I see the duet in different terms or are describing the same thing very differently. I see the duet as faster, maybe more dynamic and brighter but you has described it as warmer. I would not classify this dac as being warm at all it reminds me more of the ayre cx7e fast detailed , great image but maybe just a touch thin in the mids (or accurate and I have become used to mids thicker than natural?) Either way I would unconditionally recommend the duet to any mac user who is looking for a great dac under 1k that punches far above its class. By way of tech data this unit is said to use Cirrus CS4272 dacs I know nothing about then other than they are a 2003 design according to the Cirrus page. Anyone know anything about these chips? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tyrion Posted January 6, 2008 Report Share Posted January 6, 2008 to me the duet has deeper bass, potentially better detail and images better than the cosecant and the cosecant provides vocals and instruments in the midrange with more body and warmth. Mike you and I see the duet in different terms or are describing the same thing very differently. I see the duet as faster, maybe more dynamic and brighter but you has described it as warmer. I would not classify this dac as being warm at all it reminds me more of the ayre cx7e fast detailed , great image but maybe just a touch thin in the mids (or accurate and I have become used to mids thicker than natural?) Either way I would unconditionally recommend the duet to any mac user who is looking for a great dac under 1k that punches far above its class. By way of tech data this unit is said to use Cirrus CS4272 dacs I know nothing about then other than they are a 2003 design according to the Cirrus page. Anyone know anything about these chips? We agree on everything except as to the Cosecant providing "vocals and instuments in the midrange with more body and warmth" which is fine. For me, I think they maybe close in the mids but there is more warmth in the mids with the Duet. Some of this might be related to the gear we are using. I don't know if you are using speakers and RS-1/HP-2. I'm using different speakers/amplification (ss) and 650s which is very different than your gear, so who knows. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
n_maher Posted January 6, 2008 Report Share Posted January 6, 2008 You guys are making life awful hard for us non-MAC users. :'( Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tyrion Posted January 6, 2008 Report Share Posted January 6, 2008 You guys are making life awful hard for us non-MAC users. :'( Between the MPX3, K1000 deal and this, I'm going to be deep on your shit list. You have the Hertsens which is no slouch. I want to give it another shot v. the Cosecant and now the Duet in Mayberry. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
n_maher Posted January 6, 2008 Report Share Posted January 6, 2008 Between the MPX3, K1000 deal and this, I'm going to be deep on your shit list. I figure given my luck with the Hertsens, the Arcam CD73, the Wadia and my future project this is pot/kettle situation. Congrats on the sweet K1k deal, I need more headphones like I need another whole in the head. You have the Hertsens which is no slouch. I want to give it another shot v. the Cosecant and now the Duet in Mayberry. Well you'll get that chance. Al has agreed to babysit the Hertsens for me for a couple of weeks so it'll be there for Mayberry even though I won't. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tyrion Posted January 6, 2008 Report Share Posted January 6, 2008 I figure given my luck with the Hertsens, the Arcam CD73, the Wadia and my future project this is pot/kettle situation. Congrats on the sweet K1k deal, I need more headphones like I need another whole in the head. Well you'll get that chance. Al has agreed to babysit the Hertsens for me for a couple of weeks so it'll be there for Mayberry even though I won't. Before you ship it, through in a usb input. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Voltron Posted January 6, 2008 Report Share Posted January 6, 2008 JP#s/tyrion FOTMJP#s/tyrion FOTMJP#s/tyrion FOTMJP#s/tyrion FOTMJP#s/tyrion FOTMJP#s/tyrion FOTMJP#s/tyrion FOTMJP#s/tyrion FOTMJP#s/tyrion FOTMJP#s/tyrion FOTMJP#s/tyrion FOTMJP#s/tyrion FOTMJP#s/tyrion FOTMJP#s/tyrion FOTMJP#s/tyrion FOTMJP#s/tyrion FOTMJP#s/tyrion FOTMJP#s/tyrion FOTMJP#s/tyrion FOTMJP#s/tyrion FOTMJP#s/tyrion FOTMJP#s/tyrion FOTMJP#s/tyrion FOTMJP#s/tyrion FOTMJP#s/tyrion FOTMJP#s/tyrion FOTMJP#s/tyrion FOTMJP#s/tyrion FOTMJP#s/tyrion FOTMJP#s/tyrion FOTMJP#s/tyrion FOTMJP#s/tyrion FOTMJP#s/tyrion FOTMJP#s/tyrion FOTMJP#s/tyrion FOTMJP#s/tyrion FOTMJP#s/tyrion FOTMJP#s/tyrion FOTMJP#s/tyrion FOTMJP#s/tyrion FOTMJP#s/tyrion FOTMJP#s/tyrion FOTMJP#s/tyrion FOTMJP#s/tyrion FOTMJP#s/tyrion FOTMJP#s/tyrion FOTMJP#s/tyrion FOTMJP#s/tyrion FOTMJP#s/tyrion FOTMJP#s/tyrion FOTMJP#s/tyrion FOTMJP#s/tyrion FOTMJP#s/tyrion FOTMJP#s/tyrion FOTM Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jp11801 Posted January 6, 2008 Author Report Share Posted January 6, 2008 JP#s/tyrion FOTMJP#s/tyrion FOTMJP#s/tyrion FOTMJP#s/tyrion FOTMJP#s/tyrion FOTMJP#s/tyrion FOTMJP#s/tyrion FOTMJP#s/tyrion FOTMJP#s/tyrion FOTMJP#s/tyrion FOTMJP#s/tyrion FOTMJP#s/tyrion FOTMJP#s/tyrion FOTMJP#s/tyrion FOTMJP#s/tyrion FOTMJP#s/tyrion FOTMJP#s/tyrion FOTMJP#s/tyrion FOTMJP#s/tyrion FOTMJP#s/tyrion FOTMJP#s/tyrion FOTMJP#s/tyrion FOTMJP#s/tyrion FOTMJP#s/tyrion FOTMJP#s/tyrion FOTMJP#s/tyrion FOTMJP#s/tyrion FOTMJP#s/tyrion FOTMJP#s/tyrion FOTMJP#s/tyrion FOTMJP#s/tyrion FOTMJP#s/tyrion FOTMJP#s/tyrion FOTMJP#s/tyrion FOTMJP#s/tyrion FOTMJP#s/tyrion FOTMJP#s/tyrion FOTMJP#s/tyrion FOTMJP#s/tyrion FOTMJP#s/tyrion FOTMJP#s/tyrion FOTMJP#s/tyrion FOTMJP#s/tyrion FOTMJP#s/tyrion FOTMJP#s/tyrion FOTMJP#s/tyrion FOTMJP#s/tyrion FOTMJP#s/tyrion FOTMJP#s/tyrion FOTMJP#s/tyrion FOTMJP#s/tyrion FOTMJP#s/tyrion FOTMJP#s/tyrion FOTMJP#s/tyrion FOTM Al has a bad case of the stutters Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Voltron Posted January 6, 2008 Report Share Posted January 6, 2008 Actually I am hijacking internet signal on my son's laptop from somewhere at least a block away because nobody has power on my street. I had to use the repeat key to make my point since I lose the signal all the time. Anyway, I keed, I keed. The Duet Showdown will just be one of many nice features of the Mayberry weekend. There will be some quiet times and there will be a K1000 room during the meet itself. The Hertsens and Cosecant will have lots of company. We can even use my Pico as a dac/pre if we want to get nutty. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jp11801 Posted January 6, 2008 Author Report Share Posted January 6, 2008 ok here it is a cosecant/pico/duet throwdown Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tyrion Posted January 6, 2008 Report Share Posted January 6, 2008 Anyway, I keed, I keed. The Duet Showdown will just be one of many nice features of the Mayberry weekend. There will be some quiet times and there will be a K1000 room during the meet itself. The Hertsens and Cosecant will have lots of company. We can even use my Pico as a dac/pre if we want to get nutty. It's a good thing I have a K1000 again. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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