November 17, 2007 East Bay SOTA Meet Impressions

[Voltron]

Neil, are you moving before February? John's going to be hosting another meet that the Florida crew will attend and Aaron (honorary Florida member) as well. Willing to make a pilgrimage to hear the NWO as well as other goodness.

Who said John gets to host that meet?

I have some ideas of my own and they don't involve San Leandro. Not that there's anything wrong with it, but hey, there are other locales to check out. Also, I have a trial that month and it would be nice to avoid February 16-25 unless that jacks up your availability.

[granodemostasa]

Who said John gets to host that meet?

I have some ideas of my own and they don't involve San Leandro. Not that there's anything wrong with it, but hey, there are other locales to check out. Also, I have a trial that month and it would be nice to avoid February 16-25 unless that jacks up your availability.

so what are you thinking (out of curiosity, has there ever been a meet in The city?)?

[Voltron]

I've hosted a couple meets in SF and there was the Party at Neil's place, and I am sure others.

[boomana]

Who said John gets to host that meet?

I have some ideas of my own and they don't involve San Leandro. Not that there's anything wrong with it, but hey, there are other locales to check out. Also, I have a trial that month and it would be nice to avoid February 16-25 unless that jacks up your availability.

I've hosted a couple meets in SF and there was the Party at Neil's place, and I am sure others.

Any time in February is good for me, and I'm sure John would be glad to let you plan the meet. I think Mike mentioned something about early February as well. Are you sure Neil would want our party in his house?

[spritzer]

....

This player is extremely resolving and it tells you what it wants! After coming home from the meet, the next morning, I hooked it up to my speaker rig and just did a quick and dirty listen. Stock power cord into the wall, 1 monoblock had a stock cord into my Hydra, the other had a VD cord but into a power strip, etc... I compared it side by side my Esoreric DV-50 optically connected to the Esoteric D70 DAC. That combo actually sounds O.K. But when I plugged the NWO in this state, WOW! Later that evening, I connected the system the way I thought I wanted to. I used VD everywhere, the NWO into the wall, the monoblocks into the Powerplant Premier (which I got back from Min), and isolation platforms all around etc...

...the sound? It was 'aiight'. But not like that morning. It seems to be lacking. So out came the platforms. Hmm.. better, but not really better, just sort of perceptually so. Out came the premier. Now we were getting somewhere. Lastly... out came the VD interconnects and in went Ori X-2.

Ahhh... there it is. So now I have to put it back and see if it really is JUST the X-2 at this point. I think I may have to go and try the silver route. I think this player just really has a preference, and it is minimal. The VD stuff mates well with the HE90's and ES2, but deadens my speaker rig too much. I'll have to experiment more on both fronts.

I would go out and try some nice, revealing cables. They do not have to be silver as they could be gold, copper, amorphous metal but aim for small conductors and good connectors. No fancy RF! canceling geometry as a straight wire works best.

I didn't get to compare the ES-1 all that much to my ES-2. We'd need a more controlled environment for that I think. However, as stated earlier by Iron Dreamer, the O2 and HE90 could not be any more different from each other. If people want a case study in how associated equipment, and equipment matching in general, can have a tremendous effect or the headphone, this difference was positively Epiphanic (not sure if that is a real word, but close enough).

This mirrors my findings completely. Putting a He90 in a SR-007 matched system will only end badly and vice versa. The He60 comes closer to bridge the gap along with the SR-Omega.

[Voltron]

Any time in February is good for me, and I'm sure John would be glad to let you plan the meet. I think Mike mentioned something about early February as well. Are you sure Neil would want our party in his house?

Neil is not as fussy as you might think. But, that is not what I am thinking about for the meet. I am certain that he can be convinced to bring the NWO wherever it needs to be. I also think that we might be able to pop by his place while you and Mike and Aaron and Gene and whoever else are here. Right Neil?

I'm thinking Animal House meets Head-Fi/Case.

I'm thinking overnighter.

Wait, I'm thinking about my house so it won't really be like Animal House. But I am think my house in Marin with a sleepover option for the out-o-towners, and a party option for all.

[boomana]

I'm thinking wonderful idea! I'm in!

[Voltron]

I'm thinking wonderful idea! I'm in!

And to think that earlier I thought you might have gone to bed. \ I knew that couldn't be right. Anyway, glad to have an enthusiastic response because I am not sure this combo has ever been tried. One question would be whether some or all gear has to be put away for party time, whatever that means.

I was at the office until after midnight tonight and had to postpone birthday celebration with JP, which sucked. He was out drinking and record shopping without me, and I was toiling away. Pisses me off. Supposedly tomorrow night will be a rain-check so hopefully that will work.

[neilvg]

I hope to move ASAP. The bad news behind all that? Lugging all my heavy stuff and reconfiguring it. The good news? My new place is a condo which I bought and it is right across the street (literally) from where I live! So there will not effect any sort of February plans.

Oh and by Feb I would have totally settled in so ya'all (including you crazy Floridians) are definitely welcome to come by. My new place will be flooded with audio and the like and should be quite the place to display my gear (not just headphones).

Neil

[deepak]

My new place will be flooded with audio

You have your priorities in the right place

[neilvg]

You have your priorities in the right place

Oh yeah totally in the right place.. hehe the place will be wired to the gills for audio. It'll have a separate music studio with ~ 600sqft of space with a separate entrance for the equipment to come in. There will be a vocal booth a machine room (so no noise from computers and the like) and a console/control area. Underneath the floors I have the cabling running in a similar way radiant heating would be installed. The cables come out from the walls avoiding a wiring mess. Additionally there will be a 7.1 theater, and 2ch room, and a headphone station. So all in all, I didn't compromise on having audio all over the place

Neil

[boomana]

Oh yeah totally in the right place.. hehe the place will be wired to the gills for audio. It'll have a separate music studio with ~ 600sqft of space with a separate entrance for the equipment to come in. There will be a vocal booth a machine room (so no noise from computers and the like) and a console/control area. Underneath the floors I have the cabling running in a similar way radiant heating would be installed. The cables come out from the walls avoiding a wiring mess. Additionally there will be a 7.1 theater, and 2ch room, and a headphone station. So all in all, I didn't compromise on having audio all over the place

Neil

[Dusty Chalk]

Vocal booth? You have a home studio? What kind of music?

[tom_hankins]

Oh yeah totally in the right place.. hehe the place will be wired to the gills for audio. It'll have a separate music studio with ~ 600sqft of space with a separate entrance for the equipment to come in. There will be a vocal booth a machine room (so no noise from computers and the like) and a console/control area. Underneath the floors I have the cabling running in a similar way radiant heating would be installed. The cables come out from the walls avoiding a wiring mess. Additionally there will be a 7.1 theater, and 2ch room, and a headphone station. So all in all, I didn't compromise on having audio all over the place

Neil

I bow to you, my audio hero...

[neilvg]

Vocal booth? You have a home studio? What kind of music?

I've done a few soundtracks and we just did a musical that was performed in Seattle this June. Mostly though, those are favors for friends. I have been waiting to record and write my own music. I've played in various bands mostly as a drummer, but for the last few years I've really been focusing more on composition and keyboard and guitar. So once I move I will devote more time into this.

The music I like is generally rooted in pop but with long instrumental sections and improvisation. Not exactly prog rock per se. I'm also a sucker for beautiful vocal harmonies and I love both pastoral and spacey epics. I tend to use a lot of layering and tracking and love the dissonant counterpoint used by bands such as Gentle Giant.

Neil

[Dusty Chalk]

Cool! I've got a small home studio myself, but haven't done anything with it yet. Your music tastes are also interesting (I tend to like instrumental-heavy music, myself, although I know very little besides Pink Floyd and Porcupine Tree, and maybe King Crimson and other progsters -- I will have to check out Gentle Giant after that description).

[neilvg]

Check out:

Steve Hacket's Album - Spectral Mornings and Defector

Yes - Relayer and Going for the One

Trash Can Sinatras - Last Album Weightlifting for good Vocals and texture

Camel - Moonmadness (especially floyd-like)

The Flower Kings (More modern prog) - Space Revolver or Back in the World of Adventures

Gentle Giant - Freehand and for something spooooky and early floyd ish but darker try Acquiring the Taste

Beach boys album Smile or Smiley Smile or Sunflower/Surf's Up. Especially that last two-fer combo for exceptional vocal harmony and counterpoint. Check out the song till I die or All I Wanna do from that album.

There are so many others. You may want to start with Gentle Giant, they are a very interesting band, and like one of their album titles, may require a bit of getting used to. However, wait for the instrumental sections, and just their compositional concepts are excellent. Also it's important to seek out either japanese mini lp remasters, or modern remasters post 2001 because those early prog albums sound a hell of a lot better in these versions.

Neil

... on the party at Neil's CD sampler, we had one Camel song called "Air Born" that starts with a flute solo, which is from that album Moonmadness.

Oh, I also adore Phish the band's live performances from 97-99. Awesome stuff, especially the right songs and the right live shows.

[Dusty Chalk]

[me=Dusty Chalk]scribbles notes viciously on Post-It Notes.[/me]

Actually, I'm familiar with a lot of what you described (Steve Hackett, in particular, is a good call, and I count Yes in my top 10 favourite artists of all time), but yeah, I need to check out Camel and Gentle Giant especially.

[recstar24]

The music I like is generally rooted in pop but with long instrumental sections and improvisation. Not exactly prog rock per se. I'm also a sucker for beautiful vocal harmonies and I love both pastoral and spacey epics. I tend to use a lot of layering and tracking and love the dissonant counterpoint used by bands such as Gentle Giant.

Neil

Are you familiar with Todd Rundgren? That description sounds exactly what Todd is all about. One of his major influences was the Beach Boys, for the vocal harmonies and layering, as well as the overall Brian Wilson composition aesthetic.

[neilvg]

Love Him.

I love what Utopia has done, especially the first Album self titled Utopia. But also A Wizard A true Star, Todd, and even some of his later albums. Of course his first two solo albums (ballad of todd rundgren and something/anything) are classics.

Neil

*Also, Frank Zappa's long form instrumentals are good (not as big a fan of his sense of humour but in the right mood that is fun too) - but Inca Roads for example...

[bhjazz]

Beauty of a meet, Al and everyone. Def'nit'lee need more tubes in Seattle. GUess I'd better get soldering.

Iron_Dreamer...the photos are seriously gorgeous. I gotta ask: what camera? Wow. Thanks for posting them.

[neilvg]

Did a little write up on the APL forums and advertised us a bit. You all may be interested in the write-up since I, up to this point, compare what I have noticed between the NWO and EMM SE Stack.

http://www.aplhifi.com/phpBB/viewtopic.php?t=679&start=0&postdays=0&postorder=asc&highlight=

Neil

[Iron_Dreamer]

Iron_Dreamer...the photos are seriously gorgeous. I gotta ask: what camera? Wow. Thanks for posting them.

Thanks! It's just a Nikon D70s w/18-70mm kit lens.

[philodox]

That APL source looks incredible. I wonder if he would sprout the tubes out of the top rather than the back if you requested it? Any reason that he switched the tubes? All of the designs on his website show 6H30 tubes on the output.

[spritzer]

That APL source looks incredible. I wonder if he would sprout the tubes out of the top rather than the back if you requested it? Any reason that he switched the tubes? All of the designs on his website show 6H30 tubes on the output.

I doubt they could relocate the tubes as there wouldn't be any way to open up the player with the tubes on top. Some internal structure could be made but I just don't get the point. The 6H30 is good but the ECC99 is a better tube in many regards.