Leaving the amp on 24/7 Is it ok?

[spritzer]

I was offered one of the Flux Lab units but it was before I moved so "mehh" was my only reaction.  There have been some funny issues though, trim falling off as it is just glued in place and shit like that... 

[astrostar59]

16 hours ago, joehpj said:

Copied means you are good.

You really can't stop people doing reverse-engineering. There are all kinds of copies all over the world not limited to Taobao. B22, Dartzeel, HA5000, Rudistor, ML amps....

The best copy of Dartzeel was even a 1:1 pcb copy, because they bought a brand new one to rip apart.

So, my point is, if there's market, there's copy. It's simply different market for those who bought a genuine Dartzeel or a copied one. I for one hate copy cat but there's really nothing we can do. (at least now)

I don't think that is correct. There is copyright protection and there is general plagiarism. It that amp was shown to steal 95% of the original it could indeed be fought in the courts. Russia and China seem to expect to get away with these things, but companies that pursue this usually get results (compensation and sales blocking).

[DefQon]

50 minutes ago, astrostar59 said:

I don't think that is correct. There is copyright protection and there is general plagiarism. It that amp was shown to steal 95% of the original it could indeed be fought in the courts. Russia and China seem to expect to get away with these things, but companies that pursue this usually get results (compensation and sales blocking).

Even if thought in the courts its a useless and effortless notion because especially in China the shady individuals that close or get shut down or go into hiding today will only be replaced by another shady individual or group tomorrow. I mean the manufacturing business in China is booming, materials are cheap, labour is cheap, business is there and high in demand they can easily open a factory and do what they want without the next door neighbour knowing what they are doing, when they disappear and etc. You compare that to more structured and hierarchical civilised countries like the States, UK, Australia etc there are heavy regulations, copyright and patent licensing, stringent laws and government agencies that make sure the rest of the population is in line. With over a billion people in China and a corrupt government they don't know there ass from there elbow and its harder and much less effective to keep a watch on what's going on.

[Laowei]

Everything is fake in China. It's the way of life there. 

[DefQon]

I wouldn't go to the extent and say everything is fake but the whole copyright, patent licensing, intellectual property and ownership mean nothing to a large % of folks in China.

What Kevin should do is drop in a friendly email to Flux Labs and ask them "Did I give you guys permission to make money off my schematics?" but again I've never heard Kevin say his schematics is free for anybody to use as general purpose alike to the GNU GPL license in the software world. Though all of Kevins schematics are copyrighted.

Edited April 19, 2016 by DefQon

[spritzer]

It's more the PCB's that have a copyright as they are essentially a drawing i.e. artistry comes into it.  That is certainly the version under Icelandic law. 

[Laowei]

3 hours ago, DefQon said:

I wouldn't go to the extent and say everything is fake but the whole copyright, patent licensing, intellectual property and ownership mean nothing to a large % of folks in China.

I would. In the last 4 years I've spent over 17 months back and forth in Mainland China for business. Everything from Stinky Tofu (made with human feces instead of fermented tofu) to mink and rat meat sold as lamb in high class Shanghai restaurants. Rolexes, Beats HPs, Starbux, Obama Fried Chicken..... You name it, if it's in the PRC more than likely it's fake. 

[DefQon]

Thats just your share of bad luck with places you have come across or things you have seen or used don`t forget these people are acting as criminals in what they do for the sake of being greedy and making money. People do whatever they can to make more money and that applies to every country. People kill for money, people endanger the lives of others to make money, people create problems to make money and produce fake products to make money. Money has always been a driving factor and a creation of problems around the world. If not money then its religion but that isn`t something I`ll be discussing further as Dan won`t allow it. I`ve gone off topic enough.

Sent from my LG-D855 using Tapatalk

[astrostar59]

5 hours ago, DefQon said:

 

Thats just your share of bad luck with places you have come across or things you have seen or used don`t forget these people are acting as criminals in what they do for the sake of being greedy and making money. People do whatever they can to make more money and that applies to every country. People kill for money, people endanger the lives of others to make money, people create problems to make money and produce fake products to make money. Money has always been a driving factor and a creation of problems around the world. If not money then its religion but that isn`t something I`ll be discussing further as Dan won`t allow it. I`ve gone off topic enough.

 

Sent from my LG-D855 using Tapatalk

Copyright theft in China is on an altogether higher level. It is country wide and almost encouraged. Did you know there are clone Apple Centres in China that have staff dressed in 'official' Apple uniforms and selling 'Apple' products which are clones. Apple has struggled with the Chinese government to close them down as there are strong regional laws in each province that allow this kind of behaviour. What is bizarre is Apple assembles the iPads and iPhone at a tech city in China, thus the 'designed in California' sticker, avoiding the made in China tag.

Many well off Chinese travel to London just to buy genuine products. It is a joke. There are many badly made products not fit for purpose, the Chinese are polluting their own cities and turning the world into a landfill site i.e. products made to last lest than 12 months and discarded. They even made childrens milk that was poisoning kids in the name of profit. It is down to commercial corruption. Many Chinese don't trust their own government, it is effectively a dictatorship not a democracy. The made in China sticker makes me want to run away TBH, just like the flood of dangerous toys made for kids in HK in the 80's. They killed so many Tibetans and destroyed the buildings, then realised it was a tourist attraction, so began 'protecting' the region. Then they ate Panda's and realised that was a tourist attraction as well. It is all about money rant rant.

So where is the best place to make audio products I wonder? USA and the UK come to mind, and Iceland of course.

Edited April 20, 2016 by astrostar59

[johnwmclean]

Hang on, you bloody well forgot Australia.

[DefQon]

China was never a democratic country (but could maybe one day) and is a communist country (the current government and president is a shit head).

You also further prove my point, they do it for the money. As for best products made if I say from a build quality perspective definitely Europe (German and Swiss) high end brands. US? Not so much with the exception of Krell and few others. I have had my equal share of poorly built US made audio products before.

Sent from my LG-D855 using Tapatalk

[astrostar59]

2 hours ago, johnwmclean said:

Hang on, you bloody well forgot Australia.

Oops, do they produce anything in Australian? I though they got it all off a boat... Only kidding. Hey New Zealand have Plinius.

Edited April 20, 2016 by astrostar59

[Laowei]

3 hours ago, DefQon said:

 

China was never a democratic country (but could maybe one day) and is a communist country (the current government and president is a shit head)

 

In fact, The Republic of China was a democracy for a short period of time following the end of the Qing dynasty. From 1911 to 1949. Founded by Sun Yat-sen who was schooled in Hawaii.

With their long tradition of Confusianism I doubt if China could ever be a functioning democracy. 

And now back to the original topic.....

Edited April 20, 2016 by Laowei

[DefQon]

Well that was so long ago that it is irrelevant to todays time.

Sent from my LG-D855 using Tapatalk

Back on topic now

[joehpj]

 

8 minutes ago, Laowei said:

In fact, The Republic of China was a democracy for a short period of time following the end of the Qing dynasty. From 1911 to 1949. Founded by Sun Yat-sen who was schooled in Hawaii. 

And now back to the original topic.....

No, never really democracy. During 1911 to 1949 the whole china was almost in civil war and war against Japan. And yeah, back to topic.

[robm321]

Why back on topic? Talk more about leaving components on?

[Sherwood]

 

2 hours ago, DefQon said:

Well that was so long ago that it is irrelevant to todays time.

This is simply an ignorant world view.  You post a lot of garbage, but this is too much to go uncommented on.

China was absolutely a democracy, and the fact that the PRC was allowed to claim the title of "China" impacts all of our lives profoundly.  None more so than the poor souls who have to live there.

[mypasswordis]

^ that.

I'm glad someone spoke up. Too tired to respond to trolls and ignorant posts these days so I just stay silent, but someone at some point needs to set the facts straight.

[DefQon]

 

2 hours ago, DefQon said: Well that was so long ago that it is irrelevant to todays time.

This is simply an ignorant world view.  You post a lot of garbage, but this is too much to go uncommented on.

China was absolutely a democracy, and the fact that the PRC was allowed to claim the title of "China" impacts all of our lives profoundly.  None more so than the poor souls who have to live there.

And tell me how is this relevant to China today making fake products, producing non genuine goods and getting away with all sorts of copyright and intellectual property issues?

Sent from my LG-D855 using Tapatalk

Please tell me where in my last few posts I have been posting garbage. Please enlighten me sir.

[Sherwood]

9 hours ago, DefQon said:

Please tell me where in my last few posts I have been posting garbage. Please enlighten me sir.

I'm not speaking only of your last few posts, I'm speaking of the entirety of your time here and elsewhere.  

As to why the history of 20th century China, and specifically the war between the PRC and the ROC matters to "China today making fake products, producing non genuine goods and getting away with all sorts of copyright and intellectual property issues", it matters a great deal.  It matters because the primary actor in Chinese IP theft is not a series of private companies or "shady individuals", as you intimate, but a codified branch of the Chinese military tasked by law with doing exactly this.

Likely, these companies spend more time on networking products, wind turbines, car parts, and other high profit industries than they do on headphone amps.  Nevertheless, it is the source of the culture of theft that permeates the professional world in China.  It's naive to think that their "shitty president" (I mean come on, you can't say they're not a democracy then call their leader a president...) is the root of this, as it predates Xi by generations.  The root of it is in the root of the communist party, and specifically their plan to sustain themselves through sustained economic growth, which now requires outright theft to maintain.  They don't exactly get away with it, but how is anyone to stop them?  Again, they're not popularly elected, and they're not beholden to Chinese citizens in any meaningful way.  As long as they can stave off revolution, they're in good shape.

So whether or not they are a democracy is terribly relevant, as it explains a great deal about the country and its internal governance.  I don't expect people in general to take a great interest in Chinese politics, or to be accurate in how they speak about China, but you're contradicting people who know what they're talking about.  

Edited April 21, 2016 by Sherwood

[DefQon]

59 minutes ago, Sherwood said:

I'm not speaking only of your last few posts, I'm speaking of the entirety of your time here and elsewhere.  

 

It seems you follow me around with great interest, I applaud your attention to detail but first of all so you're saying everything I have posted thus on Stax headphones that I have opened up, even most things that have been mentioned and proven by Birgir and Kevin Gilmore before, various diy with the actual thing in front of me has been garbage so far? I suggest you take the time to trawl through the threads that I have posted in before and open your eyes and read what most of my 700ish posts have been on so far. If it contained any garbage so you have suggested Birgir or any of the other knowledgeable diy'ers here would've called it out and I would've been given a warning from Dan to re-read the welcome message many times over again and again.

Quote

 It matters because the primary actor in Chinese IP theft is not a series of private companies or "shady individuals", as you intimate, but a codified branch of the Chinese military tasked by law with doing exactly this.

Aka the Chinese government or corrupt government officials that condone this.

Quote

but a codified branch of the Chinese military tasked by law with doing exactly this.

You're not even on the same page as I am. With high quantity mass produced small electronics, re-engineering of small electronics most of that is done so with privatised companies (like Hifiman as a rough example). I have family members who live in China who own and run there own businesses with annual turn over profit in the hundreds of million yuan renminbi and some that work for various sectors of government, year after year they get reports of the local crackdowns (in the past half decade) from folks selling pirated media (movies/music) and software to domestically designed electronics on the streets (something actually prohibited to doing today) have been mostly from small time companies with no relation to the government. They get shut down, massively fined and move on and another company takes there place (the recent baby milk powder problem proves a fine example). While you do have a point and I don't disagree if you look at it overall view of IP theft and copyright issues and the bigger thefts in USD $ (damage ratio) then that's where the main actors come in the which is the corrupt sectors of the Chinese government.

Why do they do it? At the end of the day which I posted 1 page back, money.

 

Edited April 21, 2016 by DefQon

[Craig Sawyers]

Have you ever tried to export to China?  I have. They refuse to accept CE and UL approval, and insist on putting a product through their own process (protocol 60) - the company is 9 months in and counting, driven by a Chinese speaking employee.  Oh - and you have to supply full engineering drawings, full BOM and documentation pack translated into Chinese, and a product for "testing" - no ifs and buts.  The process takes an eternity, and you have to down your pants and ask them to kick you right in the ass in order to sell into China.

So do I believe that there is a policy of obstruction to exporting to China? Yes, absolutely. Where does that policy originate? The Chinese government in whatever shape you want define it.

That is leaving aside that they have had a product and manufacturing data for 9 months......

[Sherwood]

9 minutes ago, DefQon said:

What a load of shit.

Man, I'd pick the fights you think you can win.  For everyone else, my friend Chris Chappel breaks it down pretty well.

[Hopstretch]

Hate to interrupt the geopolitical discussion, but I left my BHSE on all night yesterday by accident (read, "was pissed") and it didn't burn the house down. Thanks Kevin and Justin.

[grawk]

I think you're mistaken.  It definitely did.