So is the Darkvoice or Dodge good?

[Nanoha]

I've read some rather interesting comments over the past year or so regarding the DarkVoice. Is it something like the Ming Da and Bada offerings (relatively not so good in my opinion but some are quite vocal about it), or is it actually pretty good? Would anyone take it over a PPX3 SLAM? What about the Dodge amp some other people (you know who) are pushing?

[Guest sacd lover]

I bought a Doge from you know who.

The First amp had an inoperable impedence switch, steady state low level hum and I could not get any volume out of the amp. I got the replacement and the second amp had the same problems as the first one; except the impedence switch was operable. You know who stiffed me on the return so I have sent the amp off to a head-fier for evaluation of the problem and hopefully repair. The amp does not have very good parts quality, especially the pot. From the little undistorted listening I did .... meaning no more than 78db peaks with solo voice/ acoustic guitar type music .... the amp sounded ok. I had nos GE 6BQ5's and some nice TS 12AX7's in the amp; among others. No way this amp touches a PPX3 SLAM in stock form. If the amp is repairable I am going to do some cap mods and get a different pot in the amp.

The recommendations for these inexpensive tube amps seem to come from people who have never had anything better to compare the amps to. The Dark Voice looks promising, but again, the real raves from experienced listeners generally only come after the amp is modded. If you can do repairs and/ or mod these amps then they can potentially be a good buy. But otherwise ....

[aerius]

I wouldn't touch either one of them, the build quality and QC on those cheap Chinese amps is pure utter shit, as of now I've run across more than a dozen of them at meets and so forth, there's maybe 3 or 4 which worked properly. The rest had crapped out pots, linear instead of log pots, massive hum, massive channel imbalances, and a bunch of other problems. The working ones, well, frankly I wasn't impressed by the sound at all, just the usual mushy bloated tubey crap. To me they're pretty much worthless unless you want to gut the entire amp and use the case to build your own project.

[deepak]

I wouldn't touch either one of them, the build quality and QC on those cheap Chinese amps is pure utter shit, as of now I've run across more than a dozen of them at meets and so forth, there's maybe 3 or 4 which worked properly. The rest had crapped out pots, linear instead of log pots, massive hum, massive channel imbalances, and a bunch of other problems. The working ones, well, frankly I wasn't impressed by the sound at all, just the usual mushy bloated tubey crap. To me they're pretty much worthless unless you want to gut the entire amp and use the case to build your own project.

Pretty much word for word why I didn't get a Darkvoice. Or why I'll never buy any Chinese "hifi" product.

[Nanoha]

Yeah, that's what I figured.

And here I am buying a Chinese Lite Audio DAC 38 hours before a M24 goes on Audiogon that I can afford. This sucks.

[hungrych]

Those Lite dacs look like the exeption to me, they seem really well put together and designed (just speculation though, I've never used one). I think the dac38 is a better deal than the m24, which is essentially a dac50. If you want tubes the dac-62 or something would be better, but then you don't get the benefit of balanced.

[philodox]

I would count the Eastsound CD-E5 as an exception as well. Sure, I've replaced the transport on mine now... but that is after 6 months of near constant use, and my old unit never crapped out. Got a transport for free off of Art and it is putting out beautifull music again.

I've got the zapfilter in there now as well, but unless you need really nice balanced outputs it is not really necissary. The stock single ended output stage is quite nice.

Also, I reserve my judgement on the Darkvoice. A lot of people who I trust have said good things about it, and the broken one from the meet aerius and I attended had a faulty power switch. Personally, I don't think that means the amp is poorly designed... it means it had a faulty power switch.

[n_maher]

My concern with any goods that come from outside the US has always been what do you do if repairs are needed. Whether it's a faulty power switch, crappy tube socket, etc, what exactly is your casual user supposed to do about it. It's one thing for idiots like me who'll take anything apart to go diving inside but I've met more than a few folks at meets who couldn't recognize the business end of a screwdriver. I'm not saying the equipment can't sound good just that you're up a creek if something goes wrong.

[aerius]

Also, I reserve my judgement on the Darkvoice. A lot of people who I trust have said good things about it, and the broken one from the meet aerius and I attended had a faulty power switch. Personally, I don't think that means the amp is poorly designed... it means it had a faulty power switch.

I've run into a few more since the meet, I still haven't heard a properly working one and frankly I'm not holding my breath.

[Iron_Dreamer]

It's one thing for idiots like me who'll take anything apart to go diving inside but I've met more than a few folks at meets who couldn't recognize the business end of a screwdriver.

ROTFL! I remember being like that....I think was about a year old!

[thrice]

It's one thing for idiots like me who'll take anything apart to go diving inside but I've met more than a few folks at meets who couldn't recognize the business end of a screwdriver.

Me too, man, me too. You know you're bad when you crack open new gear before you've even heard it....LOL.

[aerius]

Me too, man, me too. You know you're bad when you crack open new gear before you've even heard it....LOL.

Or when you're searching the 'net for schematics of the gear before you even buy it.

"No, I do not want yet another 300B amp using a 6SL7 input with a 6SN7 cathode follower!"

[mirumu]

Me too, man, me too. You know you're bad when you crack open new gear before you've even heard it....LOL.

Yes, warranty be damned! Where I draw the line is taking a soldering iron to it before I've even heard it.

I do own a Chinese tube amp myself, it's the Xiang Sheng 708B. It's not going to make anyone dump their high end gear but it's not as slow/mushy sounding as many others appear to be and overall is rather pleasant sounding. Cost me about US$80 and I think it's easily worth that. Build quality is low and it appears it needs modding to bring out the best in it. I think generally speaking you get what you pay for with the exception of some really good bargain gear and shabby over priced stuff. Repairs etc have never been a concern for me. Living on the other side of the world it's just as much hassle dealing with a US company as one from Hong Kong or China.

[cotdt]

I did a Darkvoice 337 versus Doge 6210 shootout writeup on head-fi. I threw in the M^3 w/STEPS just for fun. In short, both these amps walked all over the M^3. I was surprised that these simple tube circuits work so well, even compared to more modern solid state designs.

[hYdrociTy]

lol@cotdt

and

nanoha's whole setup got dissed.

[Nanoha]

nanoha's whole setup got dissed.

What?

[hYdrociTy]

What?

nevermind. i was quite confused