en480c4 Posted February 19, 2007 Report Share Posted February 19, 2007 Well, the package arrived! Wuhoo! Unpacking... Hmmmm... What is it? The Denon DA-500 With its most important feature, to me at least... The ALPHA processor! I've long loved the Denon pieces as mid-fi sources. I like the smooth presentation and warmth that their DAC and ALPHA processors provide, and it's something I've kind of built my headphone and speaker rigs around. Unfortunately my luck with Denons as transports has been, well, horrible. And now they only offer the ALPHA processor in pieces well out of my price range. So I started looking for other options. I came across this, which I hadn't seen before and figured it was worth a shot. I was very happy with my DCM-560 CD changer. It, like the DA-500, has the 20 bit ALPHA processor. I'll be curious to A/B it with the 24 bit ALPHA in my DVD-4800. If it compares favorably, then I'll be all set to use almost anything as a transport if/when the 4800 gives up the ghost, and with 3 optical and 2 coax inputs, and a optical and coax out, I should be all set to use this with my computer and the potential use of a Squeezebox or other digital transport in the future. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DigiPete Posted February 19, 2007 Report Share Posted February 19, 2007 Cool! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JBLoudG20 Posted February 19, 2007 Report Share Posted February 19, 2007 I was this >< close to wininng one over the weekend. I ended up getting a nice deal on a MSB Link III instead. Can you provide some impressions? I'm still interested in one. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JBLoudG20 Posted February 19, 2007 Report Share Posted February 19, 2007 There are also plenty of mods documented on the diyaudio forums, might want to give nate a nudge Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
en480c4 Posted February 19, 2007 Author Report Share Posted February 19, 2007 I was this >< close to wininng one over the weekend. I ended up getting a nice deal on a MSB Link III instead. Can you provide some impressions? I'm still interested in one. Well, I'll be getting it set up this evening and giving it a good listen. I'll be sure to post some impressions later. I have another one the way as well I had already bought this one and was doing some more research on it and came across another for sale. I couldn't pass it up, though I don't really have any definite plans for it. I'll have to see how much I like it to figure out if there's any way I can justify keeping two of them. If not, one might be coming available in a week or two. There are also plenty of mods documented on the diyaudio forums, might want to give nate a nudge Well, Nate's upgraded his soldering iron, and I've already inquired about borrowing the old one! More research needs to be done! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
en480c4 Posted February 20, 2007 Author Report Share Posted February 20, 2007 So the 2nd DA-500 arrived today. I had company last night & wasn't able to set up the first one with my home rig, but I wasn't going to be denied today at work! I got it set up with the digital out on the computer, which is outputting 44.1kHz through ASIO4ALL. There seems to be a pretty noticable improvement across the boards from the AlienDAC, though A/Bing is tough because of the number of drivers/settings that need to be changed. But first impressions are pretty positive. Soundstage has opened up, bass impact has increased and separation between instruments also seems to have improved. And I get the added benefit of using it to raise my monitor a few inches, which has been long overdue! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
en480c4 Posted February 21, 2007 Author Report Share Posted February 21, 2007 Well, impressions continue to be positive. It's so nice to have some pretty lofty expectations about something, receive it and still be pleasantly surprised. This is the presentation I've known and loved, and to get it for pennies on the dollar... Well, I couldn't be happier. Here it is pulling office duty: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ojnihs Posted February 21, 2007 Report Share Posted February 21, 2007 Sounds like quite the steal. I'd be interested in hearing one of those, as I like smooth and warm presentations as well. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JBLoudG20 Posted February 21, 2007 Report Share Posted February 21, 2007 I should have my DAC tomorrow, which will determine if I want to keep it or get the Denon. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
en480c4 Posted February 22, 2007 Author Report Share Posted February 22, 2007 i didn't even know denon made such a thing. sounds like it's nice. Well, they only made them for a short time, and never offered anything like it again unless you count the inclusion of the ALPHA processor into their flagship receivers. The DA-500 hit the market in '95 IIRC, with an MSRP around $850 and a street price around $600. If you like any of their players with the ALPHA, this definitely does a great job of recreating that with any digital source. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
deepak Posted February 22, 2007 Report Share Posted February 22, 2007 Not to sound cliche but would you say it sounds closer to analog? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
en480c4 Posted February 22, 2007 Author Report Share Posted February 22, 2007 For lack of a better word, yes, I'd say that. It won't smooth over bad recordings, but it does wonders in finding that balance of warmth and smoothness while maintaining a level of detail that just works, at least for me. Even -vbr .mp3 files sound great with this. The only source I've heard so far that I prefer to the ALPHA Denons was the Electrocompaniet ECD-1 DAC, which is incredible. But comparing its price to the Denon's, it should sound better. Most other "high-end" sources I've heard don't it for me. So I guess I'm lucky that short of a huge step up, I'm very happy with modest sources. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
en480c4 Posted March 6, 2007 Author Report Share Posted March 6, 2007 Well, I just figured I'd post a quick follow up... I couldn't be happier with the DA-500. I've been using it for a couple of weeks now at the office, and it sounds great. While it sucks that work's a little slow right now, it's given me a good opportunity to do some more critical listening, even if it's while I'm on the clock. The improvements from the AlienDAC are not subtle, and what's surprising is how big a difference this can make with -vbr .mp3 files. I still haven't hooked the 2nd one up at home because I've been listening so much at work and I'm usually just looking to crash to some TV or a movie when I get home. But at some point I do want to compare it to the updated ALPHA in my Denon universal player. But for now, I seem to do a majority of my listening with the computer at work, and that's where the Denon has really been able to shine. I'll say it again... it's so nice to have that sound signature I know and love with my computer. It seems like a great solution for a mid-fi rig if you can find one, especially at their current going rate. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
en480c4 Posted September 30, 2007 Author Report Share Posted September 30, 2007 Time for another follow-up... 6 months later! As some of you may have seen in the "Post Pics of Your Rig" thread, I've paired my home DA-500 with a Denon DCD-815 semi-vintage CD player from the mid-90s. I'm also using my SMC EZ-Stream wireless audio streamer with an optical digital out mod (thanks to Nate) with the DA-500. This allows me to use the DAC with both since it's in essence a digital switchbox with 3 optical inputs, 2 coaxial inputs, as well as optical and coaxial outputs. I don't know if it's the Denon house sound, the PCM-1702 DACs, their proprietary ALPHA processor or the combination of the three, but I really, really like this as my source. The presentation is very balanced, and it finds a combination of being detailed yet smooth that is pretty rare in my experiece. So many sources I've heard, especially stuff that would be considered mid-fi, are hyper-detailed to the point where they sound artificial, or are too smooth, with a kind of sheen that smears the treble detail. I'd have to say if probably leans to the warm side of neutral, and to be honest, that's right where I like things... Detailed but never fatiguing with full (warmish) midrange and bass. There seems to be excellent separation and air between the notes. And while I have to admit that soundstage (or headstage) is way down on my list of things to look for, things are easy to pick out from left to right, and while there's good width, it never seems "too" wide or artifical and maintains a cohesive image. As you can probably tell, I'm pretty happy with this purchase, especially considering I got one of the DA-500s for $100, and the other for $200. I'm sure there are any number of high-end sources out there that do more, but I can't imagine a piece that can do more for less. What's amazing is before I bought the two I have now, I had never seen one for sale. And I haven't seen one available since. I've read up on a number of mods that are out there, but to be honest, I'm a little hesitant to try any of them. I really like what I have now and hate to think that I could jeopordize that in the pursuit of improving it. In theory, there's not a whole lot in thing that can go wrong (knock on wood) since there are really no moving parts. Now transports can come and go and I won't have to worry about shelling out big bucks on Denon's high-end gear to get that house sound I like so much. I have been very disappointed with a lot of sources I've heard, including some of Denon's newer stuff like the DVD-2910. Some day I may start experimenting with gear further up the chain, but even with future plans including building a Beta22, I don't see myself looking for a new source anytime soon. Needless to say, I would definitely recommend picking up a DA-500 if you come across one at the right price and are in the market for a really great budget source. The obligatory picture: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dusty Chalk Posted September 30, 2007 Report Share Posted September 30, 2007 So basically, you have the only two in existence that you know of. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
en480c4 Posted October 1, 2007 Author Report Share Posted October 1, 2007 Something like that... Actually there are a few threads scattered in forums here and there about it, but most are years old. It's also touched upon in some DIY mod threads, but those are older as well. It's tough to track down much on it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JBLoudG20 Posted October 1, 2007 Report Share Posted October 1, 2007 I almost bought one off ebay one time, but I ran across my MSB and got that instead. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
en480c4 Posted October 1, 2007 Author Report Share Posted October 1, 2007 I got both of mine off of Audiogon. I'm certainly not looking for another, but I do find myself searching for them pretty regularly and haven't come across another for sale yet. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jinp6301 Posted October 1, 2007 Report Share Posted October 1, 2007 so you got one of these for $100? do you know the range of what they go for? I need an upgrade my entech but i has no monies Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
en480c4 Posted October 1, 2007 Author Report Share Posted October 1, 2007 I got one for $100 and one for $200... So the average for me is $150! I haven't seen many so I'm not sure what a real range is. IIRC, MSRP was $850, with a street price of $600-$650 or so when released. I don't have access to Audiogon's blue book, so I'm not sure what any others that have come up have sold for. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fred333 Posted October 16, 2007 Report Share Posted October 16, 2007 Thanks for the price range. Saves me some time on the computer. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
deepak Posted April 24, 2008 Report Share Posted April 24, 2008 I've had my DA-500 for a few months now and it is definitely a very nice source. I've done some comparisons with the North Star, and the NS is the clear winner, but it was also about 10x more expensive (I tried to open it up to take pictures, but the screws are in too tight, I was just stripping them ) Warning: this topic has not been posted in for at least 120 days. Unless you're sure you want to reply, please consider starting a new topic. (thanks for adding this warning Todd, hopefully means less newbies bumping ancient WTB/FS threads) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
en480c4 Posted April 24, 2008 Author Report Share Posted April 24, 2008 Glad to hear you're enjoying the DA-500. I've been very happy with mine and would only be upgrading if I was moving up to something like the Electrocompaniet ECD-1, which would be a significantly bigger investment. It may not excel in any area in particular, but it also doesn't seem to have any glaring faults. As a result, it still strikes me as an excellent value, especially for an older design. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Filburt Posted April 25, 2008 Report Share Posted April 25, 2008 A lot of the sound is probably due to the PCM1702. The 1702, along with the 63 and 1704, are tremendously nice sounding converters IMO. However, you can improve the performance of your DA-500 by changing the op-amps. It seems to have M5218 and NJM4570 op-amps; change the i/v converter to THS4032, and use maybe a single-to-dual adaptor with a couple of AD825s for the buffer. Add in some bypassing/decoupling if there isn't any. Try maybe 0.1uF across the rails and 100uF to ground, although there may be more optimal configurations. I think you'll enjoy the results Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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