Sennheiser HD 800 Redux

[Dusty Chalk]

Yeah, I think most people on head-case know how to listen.  Including me.  I have preferences, that's all.  It's not like I don't know what it sounds like -- I'm someone who has heard live music, I know what it's supposed to sound like.

[HeadphoneAddict]

I know you guys aren't into RSA amplifiers, but I've spent several weeks listening to my HD800 via PWD Mk2 into a balanced F-35 Lightning amplifier (via balanced silver dragon cable), and this rig has nice synergy.

The Lightning renders the HD800 less fatiguing than my WA6 or DACmini amps, and fills in that slightly lacking midrange that some people complain about, making them sound warmer and richer, albeit a little more forward and a little less spacious sounding than with my better amps. It's really strong and punchy too. It might be similar to using my old Squarewave XL, and likely more reliable. I think it offers a good bang for the buck.

It really scales up with a better source. Moving up from an iPod to a Pico DAC as source is a noticeable upgrade, but the improvement from going to a balanced perfectwave DAC is not lost on this amplifier. You could probably enjoy it as a desktop replacement amp after you buy the best source you can afford, until you can buy a better amp later. It's not on par with my ZDT or EF6 amplifiers which pair very well with HD800, but it also costs a fraction as much, leaving more money for the source.

Not planning to drive both orthodynamics and HD800, don't want to recable, or have a smaller budget or allergy to RSA amps? Then the Hifiman EF-2 is actually quite nice with HD800 too, although with a much smaller soundstage and less power.

[spritzer]

I don't have allergy to RSA amps, I just happen to not like 20% THD from a headphone amp.  Kinda defeats the purpose of one when all it does is limit volume and add distortion. 

 

The HD800 is picky but being used to the SR-007Mk1 I can't say that it's a bad thing.  They simply need a good, stable amp to drive them which can handle the quirky impedance behavior.  Now this excludes 95% of the amps out there so people swing the other way and use badly designed garbage such as the Alo Studio Six and Leben to mask what they find offensive in the transducers character.  One could argue that this is defeating the point of buying them in the first place though... 

 

It's the same crap as with the 009, so many think that simply adding distortion will fix what they find wrong with the transducers. 

[justin]

The balanced rsa amps should be better as they wont suffer from the 25mA limitation of the TLE2426 virtual ground which serves as a frequency dependent, high distortion bottleneck Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[complin]

Problem also are the modern close miked recording techniques which spotlight certain instruments in the orchestra. At a live concert you would never hear the music reproduced in this way. Some of the most natural orchestral recordings come from the 60's and 70's where the engineer tried to capture the cohesive whole of the orcestral sound and the hall acoustic, rather than the ultra analytical spotlighting. 

 

There's also the problem that some who haven't heard a live orchestra/band have no real point of reference to guage what it should sound like.

 

Hearing recorded material through cheap coloured headphones/speakers will set that as the standard of what things should sound like.

 

[Riotvan]

They are brutal.  With good source material, they are amazing.  With less good source material, I grab my Etymotics.  The ER-4S is much more forgiving than the HD-800, in my opinion, and this is after doing the mildest foam mod on the Senns.  I'm using a recent Benchmark DAC-1 and a SquareWave XL, single ended (I've run these balanced, and if anything, it just makes them even more brutal).

I hear ya, luckily with this hobby one tends to have more then one headphone. I do have some warm sounding amp's as well(V200 and a custom tube amp) so the gear and music collection should be up for it. But i'll just have to try it out on the current setup, last time the treble bothered me a bit but in retrospect that was music choice and dac. And if that all fails it will go back and i'll stop trying!

[aerius]

Yeah, I think most people on head-case know how to listen.  Including me.  I have preferences, that's all.  It's not like I don't know what it sounds like -- I'm someone who has heard live music, I know what it's supposed to sound like.

 

Even with live unamplified music, there's still the question of what's "neutral" or "right".  Move the same musicians to a different venue and the sound changes; which one is right?  Other than something blatantly awful like a bathroom, we could have endless discussions on what's "right" based on our personal preferences, and I think that carries over to some extent in our headphone & audio gear choices.

[Dusty Chalk]

(a) They're both right.  Haven't you figured that out yet?  There's a reason reverb plugins come with "small hall" and "large hall" settings.

 

Bathrooms are awesome for recording vocals.

 

Besides, the comment was in a response to Wink likening me to someone who's never heard high fidelity before.

[complin]

Problem is we dont know how the recording was laid down. Often recordings can be a compilation of material recorded in different venues at different times. There was an excellent seminar about this given at RMAF in 2012. I think the video of it is still up on the site,  

 

Even with live unamplified music, there's still the question of what's "neutral" or "right".  Move the same musicians to a different venue and the sound changes; which one is right?  Other than something blatantly awful like a bathroom, we could have endless discussions on what's "right" based on our personal preferences, and I think that carries over to some extent in our headphone & audio gear choices.

[luvdunhill]

Does it matter how the original was laid down? Can't LFF just fix it?

[K3cT]

If I find the ECP L-2 to be too soft/polite sounding with the HD800, do you guys think the DHSA will be a better bet?

[complin]

In short no, not without manipulating the material first

Have a listen to this 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=_aOTmyaKSV0

 

 

Does it matter how the original was laid down? Can't LFF just fix it?

Edited December 25, 2013 by complin

[spritzer]

It was a joke given the crap LFF puts out...

[tin ear]

Who or what is LFF and merry Christmas.

Edited December 25, 2013 by tin ear

[luvdunhill]

In short no, not without manipulating the material first Have a listen to this

Needs more plankton.

[blubliss]

If I find the ECP L-2 to be too soft/polite sounding with the HD800, do you guys think the DHSA will be a better bet?

I would say yes, and I heard both in my setup at the same time.  The DSHA is a bit tighter, but it is still not the end all in resolution...very nice though.

[complin]

Would that be Orthodynamic Plankton

 

Needs more plankton.

[K3cT]

I would say yes, and I heard both in my setup at the same time.  The DSHA is a bit tighter, but it is still not the end all in resolution...very nice though.

 

Very interesting. Finding a good balance between resolution and listenability is truly a challenge with these phones, β22/Dynahi seems to excel in the former but something with less edge and tizz will be very welcome.

 

I haven't been here in a while but apparently the DSHA-1 is discontined now? I suppose I have to wait to see what Doug has in store before jumping the shark.

[HeadphoneAddict]

Needs more plankton.

No, needs more caffeine. I really fell asleep watching it.

[dcpoor]

Started listening a few hours ago to the hd800 I purchased from the Amazon deal...

 

Am I allowed to enjoy them this much from a Gilmore Lite?

Or is it mandatory to get a higher end amp first.

[Torpedo]

Yes you are, the HD800 isn't a bad match to the Dynalo-Dynamid at all. Depending on your source, I'd eventually upgrade it before getting a different amp.

[complin]

Yes the Gilmore LIte was the first amp I tried that make them listenable

I havn't heard the DHHSA 1 or 2, but you should also try the Apex Peak/Volcano and roll a few tubes. The frequency extension at both ends is amazing and really plays to the HD800 IMHO.

Edited December 27, 2013 by complin

[dsavitsk]

I haven't been here in a while but apparently the DSHA-1 is discontined now? I suppose I have to wait to see what Doug has in store before jumping the shark.

 

It is not so much that they are discontinued, as that they were not recontinued. The idea is the come up with a design that I like, make a small run, sell them, and move on to something else. There are so many circuits to explore that doing the same thing over and over is just not that interesting. For what it's worth, I just ordered a run of transformers from Cinemag that should be here some time in late January. Hopefully completed amps will follow not too long after that.

[shellylh]

^Time to start saving up. 

[complin]

You must have a very short attention span

 

No, needs more caffeine. I really fell asleep watching it.