aardvark baguette

I really hope we're not going to turn this into a "people who vote for _____ are ________ " thread.

I voted for Bush over John Kerry and Al Gore, absolutely. I do regret how the republican party has handled things the last few years, financially. Pretty much the opposite of what I wanted. Obviously I have more issues with an Obama presidency than a McCain presidency, or I wouldn't have been engaged in 7 pages of conversation.

people see what they want to see. [ame= - Barack Obama Makes Shocking confession!![/ame] [ame= - The shocking Barack Obama debate you haven't seen!![/ame]

I think the best answer is to get a hold of spending before changing where they're at right now. I favor a spending freeze over more taxes and or tax cuts.

I didnt mean to imply Obama himself demonized him. He was certainly respectful on camera. But the fallout after, with his campaign, and various pundits digging into his past tax history, and trying to dig up dirt, was a ridiculous thing to do to someone who simply asked a question. Obama and McCain are not necessarily socialists themselves, like I said, that may be too strong a word. But the act of giving taxes back to people not paying in the first place, the concept seems pretty close to socialism to me. I realize its been going on for a long time, but I dont see how that makes it not so. Hopefully it will do some good, otherwise it would be an incredible waste, especially during such a bad time in our nation's economy. I feel that Obama used the "95%" tax return talking point a little aggressively, and I think thats why you get so many people arguing about socialism. When that becomes the main priority in a campaign, the masses simply vote themselves money. I think its highly possible it will not lead to permanent good. Its not like $500 is magically going to get all the disenfranchised a college education that Obama seems to think is a birthright. Its setting up bad habits. You can expect a wealth of future candidates to run on a platform of "giving back to the community" now that his campaign has proven successful. Overtime, people will view government hand-outs a right, not a privilege.

Joe "the alleged" Plumber? I take it you bought into the demonizing of the man who had the "audacity" to question Obama who walked down his street while he was playing catch with his son? Yes, rich people have been paying more taxes for a long time. Its always been that way, and always will, most likely. Does that mean they just withdraw from the political process, rather than try to lower their rate somewhat? People that dont make enough to pay taxes shouldn't get money directly from a tax break. His plan is like welfare, only he is giving it to people who havent even applied for welfare in many instances. You can argue either way whether or not they deserve it, but the fact remains they paid no taxes. I'm of the mindset that, particularly in an instance of a surplus, people who pay taxes should get the tax breaks. It makes more sense for the person who paid the most to get back the most.

make that 3 of us

I'm not quite sure what to call giving tax breaks to people who dont pay taxes, if socialism is too strong a word. Any ideas?

The amp in an ipod drives them reasonably well. Any amp as strong should suffice, imo.

The problem is most everything they believe, politically, is based on their belief system. All of our opinions stem from our beliefs, religious, atheist and agnostic. You cant just nix them out, it doesnt work that way.

Thats a very open and tolerant view

wow, there is a lot of hatred of religion here.

how the hell did that happen in California?

I was in elementary school, so I didnt know the difference.

I just remember noticing he played saxophone, and so did I. It was kind of neat. That was about my involvement back then

While not a complete success, positive things happened. Enough to the point where "failed policies" is too strong a term, imho. After 9/11, during 2 wars, we were kept safe on our shores would be one major point. During the first 6 years: Consumer confidence stood at a 2

As for republicans, in my personal opinion, its time to leave behind the majority of social issues, i.e. gay marriage. Its just baggage at this point. All I want is clear-headed, rational spending and decision making. I dont like taxes and I think people should pull their own weight whenever possible. I also dont think the entire system is broke to the point of re-writing laws or adding new amendments. A big move toward center is needed. The thing that really killed it for republicans is all the corruption circa 2006. All the child molesto bullshit. Its such a stupid problem to be having. I do feel that Obama was unfair calling it "8 years of failed policy" though. That completely writes off six years. With all the fuck-ups of Bush, it will be interesting to have someone fresh in office, I have to admit. But the entire campaign was based on change, so it will be interesting to watch and see if he continues to focus on 2001-2008, and blame everything on that window of time, or step up and make it happen, and accept any consequences.

high five o/\o

Nor I with McCains.

I just want to go on record; it is Obama's platform I disagree with. I respect him as a person. I think its ok to disagree with someone's "gameplan" without hating them in any way.

I apologize on my part.

my eyes

@gloco You do realize that you are assuming the entire republican party is racist, right? That is how you are wording it. I'm not saying there aren't racists out there, but to label the entire party as such is just ignorant and hypocritical.