recstar24

Yah. The moth is huge, compared to the hornshoppe horns, which are only 6 inches wide and 11 inches deep:o

Don't worry, 6' is plenty, the picture from the distance I took it makes it look pretty wide, it's not. 6' will be very nice in fact, pretty straight connection with some flexibility and a small loop, and will accomodate placing it even further if i ever wanted to, or if placed in a different room. I just measured from the binding posts from the amp to the speaker, its a straight loose line of 4'. That should be plenty, and if it goes well, might actually be just enough slack to keep it elevated off the floor;D BTW - thanks Nate for sending the speaker cables today:D

New setup, corner loaded left speaker Much better, wife has commented "oh the sound is richer now":p

They came in today. They are pretty small actually, my gear rack isn't that big. They image incredibly well. The tone is pretty right on, and do not sound as lean as other single drivers that I have heard. The bass is pretty decent for a 4.5 in not in the corners, I do not have them corner loaded but they are against the wall and the bass quality is very nice, just the lowest notes are not quite there, but what is there is excellent. I have not messed around with placement, right now the balance is just a bit slighted up top, but nothing offensive. THe sound carries off axis very well. It's no cornwall, but it definitely is more "practical" as the cornwalls i saw yesterday were beasts of burden.

Today, I had got to bring my moth over to a local guy and listen to his cornwalls that he listed on craigslist. Wow...I cannot believe that such a dynamic, full bodied sound could come from a mere 3 watts. The bass was pretty outstanding, it literally kicked you in the chest. There was absolutely no horn shout. The integration between the drivers was excellent, as I was listening, I really wasn't analyzing the sound, just enjoying the music. Nothing at all what I was expecting. simply amazing, I think PWK knew what he was doing after all. BTW - the wife has approved the cornwalls;D I think I am going to hold off for a minty set at a decent price. I do have the horns coming in tomorrow, unfortunately my expectations have been set pretty high after listening to the cornwalls.

Well, I should be able to compare both the horns and cornwalls in my room, compare, and go with the better fit. Horns I could get sometime next week, cornwalls I might be picking up later this week. I will have to do something real nice for the wife though before those cornwalls come in thats for sure.

Thanks Aerius for chiming in, your probably the only person I am familiar with that has experience with the enabl process. The horns that I have coming in have actually been treated by Bud Purvine himself, so I'm pretty excited.

For Cornwalls? I'll manage:D

Valid point - in my research, I believe single driver speakers, to have any resemblance of bass or full bodied tone, while still remaining sensitive, need to be either one of two things. 1) Big fracken horns that takes up massive amounts of space 2) corner loaded horns I have listened to various single drivers in bass reflex, transmission line, sealed loading, and they all have the same sound characteristics - thin, lack of weight in bass, upper midrange shout. The smaller drivers do the midrange right and don't beam the highs, but you don't get the excursion down low while being high sensitive. The bigger drivers can kick you in the face but then the highs beam and the midrange shouts as the frequency increases, then you need a whizzer to help the dispersion of the highs, and I don't want to go the whizzer route again. I think the only way to get the lower excursion needed for bass while remaining high sensitivity throughout the lower bands is to corner load. The corner and wall reinforcement acts as an extension of the mouth of the horn. The rear horn loading prevents the horn colorations for mixing with the driver output. Bass is omni-directional so it will find its way to me somehow some way. I have some wall reinforcement as is, and with a little tweaking, I can get one good corner and a good wall, maybe if I am lucky I can get 2 corners. All I know is it might be worth it to try something that I haven't tried before, and who knows it may work or it may not. But I should be able to sell them pretty easily as horns go really fast on the gon, and they rarely come up for sale. If all else fails, I will just get some cornwalls and damn it if my wife complains.

Har har - don't be silly when it comes to room acoustics, I mean business;) The more I think I about it, the more I probably should avoid that set-up of the right speaker loaded into the corner wedged right beside the door. Not very effective me thinks...

Oh, to add to what you said earlier - I should be able to rearrange my set-up to get at least one of the horners fully corner loaded, and the other back against a wall. Current set-up - rack and rig set-up in corner, butted up against side walls, horns would be off to the sides, against their respective back walls for some acoustic gain and bass assistance. Right speaker location Left Speaker Location Other side of the room away from the listening rig. Someone on audiocircle suggested placing the TV on the far wall, shifting over the couch and loveseat, and opening up those two wonderful corners, each to the side of the TV area. That would be perfect, but knowing my wife she will veto the bill when it passes through congress to her desk. This is the other side of the listening area opposite where the rig is located. I could swap the location of the bookshelf and rig, and put them in those corners. The only problem is that door jamming up against the right corner is a bathroom door, so I would have to make sure no one using the bathroom slams the door into the right speaker. That does look kind of ghetto though, but technically it could work. I will try the set-up shown in the 1st pic 1st, then try moving the rack over to the right on the wall, and loading the left speaker into the corner where the rig was located, and the right speaker to the right. You will get the most acoustic gain and lower bass cutoff by fully corner loading both speakers, but even corner loading one will reap some benefits, as sounds below the 200 hz are pretty much omni-directional, and the listener would hear the bass as being "equal" from each speaker, even though one is only corner loaded.

Well, I am pretty much sold on the used horns that I was offered, price is pretty good considering. Jury still out on the enABLed process that the drivers have on them, but by all accounts, the manufacturer of the horns himself has stated that it doesn't appear to ruin or necessarily change the sound sig drastically (paging aerius...)

Yeah, the trannies are a chunk. My original moth s2a3 had the output trannies and the psu trannie all in the same chassis. Combine that with the military crate and that was not fun getting up two floors when i picked it up fedex. At least this new moth version has the separate power supply so some of the weight is lifted off, but even still it is a chunker. The eml's are very tall, much taller than normal globe rca 45's and you can see the reference, how much it dwarfs the normal mullard rectifier that is there as well.

Got an offer on some hornshoppe horns, very good price...but the drivers have been modified with that enAble process or whatever you call it. Looks like some ghetto hack, haven't done too much research though on the process.

Update: I've narrowed it down to two options - hornshoppe horns or vintage klipsch heresy's. The horns have a small footprint and their rear loaded horn design meant to be placed closed to walls or corners fits well in my room setup. apparently in certain rooms the bass can actually be too much which is scary to think coming from a SD - my kind of speaker;) The heresy's are vintage klipsch, I would love the cornwalls but they are too big. The heresy's are also meant to be placed close to walls or corners, and the 3 walls of reinforcement a nice big sound can be achieved. Still on the lookout for used horns, but I do have an audition set up in about a month from a local person on audiocircle. I have a set of klipschs waiting for me to pick up cheap but I am still waiting on driver pics.

Finally got around to taking some inside pics when I went in to swap out the 6j5's for some metal based sylvanias. Here is a comparison of the older moth si2a3, notice the power transformer is in the main chassis. So far this amp has really impressed me, and I have no regrets in selling the Zana to go with the moth si2a3/45H. I am positive that I am a transformer kind of guy, I just really dig the sound. Craig really put some major thought into this amp because it has as much detail and transparency as the ZD, and at times I almost believe it has a touch more focus and clarity in certain parts, but tonally the moth sounds more wet, at least with my low impedance grados. Doesn't hurt to be using the EML 45's which have really blossomed into something extraordinary. Now time to pick up some sensitive speakers and snag some EML 2a3's and I think I'm good.

If I had $3000, I would buy a set of speakers. Damn it Jacob, see what you've done to me? You've won this round...

Thanks for the rec, yeah I think coaxial is a good option. I appreciate the headsup.

I think I may be getting close... Hammer Dynamics Some pretty good reviews on fullrangedriver forum, audiocircle, audioasylum, DIYparadise, etc. Basically we are dealing with a custom made 12" driver for the bass and mids, crossed over at 10 khz to a tweeter with a 1st order crossover. A 12" driver not only would have good sensitivity but this particular driver is also slated to have a very smooth impedance nominal at 8 ohms. A 12" driver should really have some nice kick as well. It comes in kit form for $650, so I will need to see if I can get someone to build the cabs for me.

welcome audiodwebe! I am glad you found this site. There is a plethora of information here that is very helpful. But hopefully you have some thick skin;) Yes, I should get some info from audioasylum, there high effieciency board is pretty active. Jacob, don't take offense, it's just I think the speakers that the guys here have are waaaayyyyy beyond what I can have, afford, or even be able to drive with only 3 watts max. I believe that is what audiodwebe was referring to. He's a good guy, and the proud new owner of the zana that I used to own:p

...wait a minute...I was wondering why my wallet was starting to cry:palm:

Hell yeah they would, but no way I can power up ribbons with my 3 watts. Coincident Speaker Technology Loudspeaker Page Coincident seems to be the only "hi end" speaker company that is able to make a multi driver design that is very effiecient and SET tube friendly with relative high impedance. The super victory, though expensive, is listed as a 10 ohm speaker, nice and easy for a SET to drive - the cicadas were 12 ohms I think so SET's had a nice easy job driving them and is a big part of their sound and fullness. It can't be that hard to make a speaker that you can pump a couple of watts into or many more. It almost seems like the best speakers require heroic amplification, and I am not even looking for that, just something that plays music in my decent room that I don't have to fuss with, and will play with enough volume to get the air moving. But it seems like the only options are single drivers, and I've already went down that route, so we will see.

(...waving hand in back of classroom...) Helloooo guys, remember me, attention please, focus on me me me thank you:p

Arg, looking at my layout don't think I have the corners for them, if so, I would have bit on cornwalls a long time ago. I would have to reorganize the room completely and I know the wife wouldnt be too happy with that:palm: