swt61

Happy Birthday Ken!

To get the most creative gifts, you should reverse that order.

From a guy who knows a little bit about playing with a nice instrument all evening, congrat CJ.

Exactly!

Gun loving liberal? You my friend are as rare as the homosexual republican.

This!

Happy Birthday!

^ Sad, but true.

Also to verify, it wasn't this Mercury?

Had mine several years with no cable issues.

A heavy tax on guns and ammo should cover it. JUST KIDDING! Lighten up.

In fact there are a lot of things we can do to start. Problem is they will piss off as many people or more, than are angered by the thought of any gun legislation. Deny it, call it ridiculous, whatever, but it is my full belief (as well as many others) that violence in video games and movies most certainly has a desensitizing effect. Both parents at work and kids monitoring themselves is another contributing factor. Rampant "medicate the problem" ideologies, as well as basic things like quality of food and water all contribute to the problem. Mental illness is not all luck of the draw. We as a society are generating cases in many ways.

A car accident is exactly that...an accident. A mass killing is intentional. I do agree that acting during an emotional state can be a bad decision. All I'm asking is that we don't just put this aside once the fervor dies down. Anyone near my own age knows how drastically these acts have risen during our lifetime.

IMO if we turn our heads from 20 small children being slaughtered at school because "sometimes bad things happen", then we've committed a grave crime ourselves. I know that mental illness is the root here. However that could become as big of a concern for personal freedoms as gun control. #1) Getting a good grasps on who is and who isn't mentally ill is a monumental challenge. #2) I can easily see factions of our government using mental illness laws to determine who they believe is a threat to their own agendas, and then completely contorting those laws in their own favor. It's a problem with no easy solutions, and no solution that is going to be acceptable by all. However we have to purists, because learning to live with these events is something my conscience will not allow, and I hope many more feel the same.

DON'T !!! There is zero reason for you to feel the least bit guilty. Enjoy your free day!

Ric you have just expressed my feelings so much better, and more eloquently than I ever could have. A thoughtful, concise and thought provoking post. BTW, I'm also from a big hunting family. Guns were a part of life in my upbringing. Both of my Brother's received their first gun once they turned 12. I refused to shoot the Winchester 3030 he gave me when I turned 12. That was more about not wanting to be forced to be somebody I wasn't, than it was about guns.

I loved that movie!

I feel better. I really thought you had some agenda with me. I understand this is a serious issue for you. I really don't have strong gun control leanings, I'm just really confused, frustrated and deeply saddened whenever kids are hurt. This goes way beyond that. I still believe we need to discuss this issue though, even if we can't reach an understanding at this time.

Dusty, I have never considered you to be homophobic or bigoted in any way. I've known you now for several years, and it would be impossible for me to think anything like that. I completely understood your use of the gay marriage scenario. What hurt me was solely this sentence... That seemed very much directed at me personally, given the context of the post, and now your acknowledgement of such. The use of the word "sicken" in its context seems to me more than generally argumentative, and very personal. Firstly I'm still not sure you really understand my values, as up to this point you seem to want to place me fully on one side of the issue. I am not fully on either side, and I think my posts reflect that. I don't know what I've done to offend you, but it seems to me that I have. I'm truly sorry if I have, as that was never my intent. Again I'm confused. I've looked back at all of my posts in this thread, and I don't see the words "allowed to". In any case it's no longer important to me. I'm a big boy, I'll get over it.

Happy Birthday Guys!

Ken, I know Dusty is not homophobic. I know that he is not disparaging gay marriage. Dusty doesn't have a mean bone in his body, and I know that. That said... This statement really hurt, although I realize it was not intended to. That is a sore spot for me, and I guess I feel that should be obvious. I've had other peoples values shoved down my throat my entire fucking life! I thought I made it clear in this thread that I did not want to impose my values on others, but instead wanted and welcomed everyone's ideas. Do I think that gun control might be part of the solution? Yes. Am I willing to mandate (like I held such a power) such a solution without hearing all sides for any other options. No. This was about turning a ridiculous thread into a meaningful discussion on solving a very real issue. Maybe I am too sensitive to be involved in this thread. Bowing out now.

I don't know where you're going with this, but if you don't believe that a heterosexual belief system has been imposed on me my whole life you're sadly mistaken! I do not have the right that you do to marry who I chose. I could be fired for being gay, without any legal recourse. I believe I'm in the last minority group to not be given that protection. I can go on. I'm fully aware of what it is like to have beliefs I disagree with imposed on me. I have learned to bend, and have learned to try to educate. I also have not gotten personal in this thread, and I really don't appreciate you going there.

Ken you make an excellent point.

So if self defense is really the main concern with gun control, what about incapacitating weapons? One could defend themselves with stun guns and the like. And yes these too could be used inappropriately, but I doubt we'd see mass killings if all the perps had on hand were non lethal weapons. Dusty, you're solution if I'm understanding you, is to ignore these horrific mass killings because they don't directly affect us, and go on with life as though nothing happened? It's completely possible that because I'm gay I'm over sensitive. I do tear up at sad TV shows and movies, hell, even commercials. These kinds of tragedy's tend to affect me deeply. So maybe I'm just not able to put myself into the mindset of a less sensitive psyche, but I think we can do better. I think it's our obligation as concerned, caring human beings to keep trying to do better. I don't know any of the people involved in this terrible situation, but I can't turn my head and forget it's happening. I DON'T EVER WANT TO HAVE THE ABILITY TO DO THAT!

Good luck Jacob!